I know there must be a lot of you out there who think I hate orthodoxy and this is why I make fun of it, but that couldn’t be farther from the truth. The fact is that I myself am pretty frum in practice, existentially troubled in belief and was given a very good observational eye by the Lord, but I am a big supporter of those who want to be frum and frummer than everyone else – I just don’t like when they shove it on others. One of the reasons I first started writing this blog, besides making millions of dollars and getting some action, was to vent my frustrations at a frum community that seemed to be heading towards this social orthodoxy, where everything was done to impress upon others that they were frum. It seemed to me, that orthodoxy for the sake of serving the Lord, bettering oneself and helping others had been replaced by social orthodoxy. Basically, everyone was trying to one up each other.
Until I went to yeshiva, I had no idea that people placed so much value on how one dressed and spoke. I had no idea that the way I said things would determine which level of frumkeit I belonged to. I had no idea that I was a lesser being because I had gone to coed camp or that my father wore blue jeans. Sure, these things seem asinine, but I’m truly hurt by what the frum community has become.
One of the reasons I hate New York so much is because I’m not proud to be a Jew when I’m there. Sure, there are plenty of good Jews, but I guess when you have so many of them in one place – you start to feel lost and you also start to feel the effects of different frum communities trying to one up each other. Small communities always appealed to me, because no matter what level of observance you were holding at, you were accepted with open arms (not always true) and the community was usually made up of a hodgepodge of people – so that when someone from the East Coast would ask how many “frum” people lived in such and such a community – you could respond: It depends what you mean by frum.
I know some of you may be surprised by the following statement, but one of the biggest reasons why I dislike the Bay Area is that there is no yeshiva here. Even if I never visited the yeshiva, just the fact that there were some Jews devoted there lives to Torah would have some sort of comforting feeling – even if I don’t necessarily agree with that lifestyle. I kind of look at it like art – not everyone understands it, but for some reason it’s necessary.
I like frummies, but I hate when the force their frumkeit on me. I understand that in many situations one should take the “when in Rome” approach, such as dressing modest when walking through a religious neighborhood, but this “when in Rome” can only go so far. I wish for the good name of the Jewish people, that the ultra-Orthodox Jews in Israel would figure out a way towards peace with their secular brethren, rather than rioting, boycotting and fighting. I wish there could be a different approach to Jews who are more or less religious than us. It just seems that rather than helping to bring the Moshiach, we’re pushing him/her farther away.
If you want to be frum that’s amazing. If you think your way is the “authentic” way to practice that’s great, but don’t start telling others what to do until you have it down and think you know the right way to bring people closer rather than push them away. Spewing forth rabid right wing orthodox hatred towards those who may be going against the Torah is not a Jewish value and won’t bring Moshiach any quicker.
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{ 42 comments… read them below or add one }
Thank you, Heshy!
2 thumbs ^
THIS IS SUCH A CHILUL HASHEM!
Excellent post.
Lots of us, especially former yeshiva guys, feel like this.
First time posting here after lurking for a while.
I really leveled with this post. Agree and feel the same way.
I’m contemplating getting the hell out of a big city also. Tricky part is I need somewhere with frum schools. We have 3 kids now.
Maybe San Diego?
What ever happened to that Valencia community project?
Colorado?
Ari, try my old stomping grounds, Columbus, Ohio.
K-12 day school, friendly community, mostly MO, with a black hat kollel, but the kind of kollel that gives classes and mingles with the community. # Orthodox shuls, one traditional Conservative inside the eruv.
And MUCH lower cost of living than the San Diego. Or even Colorado.
Only problem is it’s f@cking columbus.
The Keatons would beg to differ.
Yeh, it would take a lot of money to get me to move to Ohio.
ye. im thinking of a smaller transition, like from LA to the valley
thx for suggestions
OTDB, have you ever been there? Because of OSU, Columbus has more culture than other parts of Ohio, cool music festivals, good theater, and Comfest, where topless is allowed.
It’s also got a pretty good quality of day-to-day life.
That doesn’t mean it’s never boring, but it’s got a lot of pluses.
texas
Well, the bay area has a kollel, so that’s kind of good in that direction, at least.
The kollel here is not even a community kollel, they really only do stuff for non-religious folks. Sure, a few folks learn in the kollel, but rarely are they giving classes in the orthodox shuls.
Oh. I dunno much about it. But my brother’s brother-in-law is in it.
You should be grateful to those who are “pushing Moshiach away.” After all, didn’t you say how much you like the galus in the Shemona Esrai post? If we bring Moshiach, she (lol) is just going to end the galus.
“she (lol)”
nice.
This is one of your best, most thoughtful posts.
I agree.
“It seemed to me, that orthodoxy for the sake of serving the Lord, bettering oneself and helping others had been replaced by social orthodoxy.”
Heshy, sometimes you make really good, sharp observations. This is one of them. So true!
“It just seems that rather than helping to bring the Moshiach, we’re pushing him/her farther away.
Like
I want to add my two cents; I like this post.
there used to be a yeshiva in the bay area (in santa clara), you should do some research on why it closed…
You are right, it’s not always true that smaller communities are more accepting of all Jews, regardless of level of observance. I live in Dallas, and the Jewish conmmunity here is heavily divided. In that I am somewhere between the extremes, I feel isolated. It seems that I am too “Orthodox” for the more liberal streams of Judaism, and too “liberal” for the purely Orthodox. I am just trying to find my own path, I don’t care about labels. Is this wrong?
No, it isn’t wrong. What is wrong is making other people feel bad for having a different level of observance than you, or for interpreting the mitzvot in a different way that you do. I wish more people understood this.
Elaborate on that please.
Are you referring to someone who goes out of his way to insult other people for not keeping the torah? That would be one extreme, and I certainly don’t think anyone should do that. Unless we are talking about an actual mumar and not just a tinok shenishba.
Are you referring to someone who just keeps the torah, and does so even when others may be annoyed or insulted? Like walking out when there is kol isha? That is the other extreme, and I find it hard to imagine you could condemn that.
Maybe you are talking about a middle level, where it isn’t a matter of violating your own beliefs, and you are not trying to insult the other people, but you aren’t particularly careful not to either. Like for example what I do on this website. I hear that one.
You don’t need to walk out if a woman is singing. If you don’t want to listen to it, you can concentrate on something else, like reciting prayers in your head, doing multiplication tables, or anything else quiet you find distracting. These strategies are particularly useful because sometimes walking out isn’t an option, such as when you’re in the military and you have been ordered to be there.
Of course, if you do walk out, how do you do it? In a noisy, disruptive way, or in a quiet way, like someone would do if they suddenly had to use the restroom and didn’t want to interrupt the performance?
I don’t need to walk out if a woman is singing? Are you saying you think that is the halacha, or that you think I should not follow halacha? The halacha is principled- we aren’t making this stuff up. As anyone who has studied it knows.
How do I walk out? I try to walk out unobtrusively. I try even harder to have not been in the situation to begin with. Why do you assume I make a scene?
I am saying you don’t need to walk out, because I have read of Orthodox rabbis who say they don’t have to walk out.
Why do you assume that I assume you make a scene? I was asking a question, and I was asking it rhetorically of people in general, not you personally, Dan.
Ah. So some orthodox rabbis say you don’t have to.
So am I bound to follow those ones? I follow the ones whom I usually follow for all other matters. And the one’s I follow think that they are incorrect, and politically motivated.
You’re not bound to follow those rules. It is an option. We all have options.
Ah, so it comes down to that you think I should not follow my religion, because your interpretation of my religion is different than my interpretation of my religion.
You know what we call that in America? Bigotry.
In no case did I ever say you should not follow your religion. Where do you get this stuff? You asked if you were bound to follow the rules of the rabbis who say you don’t have to leave, and I answered that, no, you don’t have to follow those rules. I think you should follow the halacha as you understand it.
You have the option regarding which rabbis interpretations to follow. I have the same option, to follow the (different) interpretations of other rabbis. I trust you agree, since I trust you are not a bigot.
By the way, calling someone a bigot, and saying rabbis make halachic rulings for political reasons, is lashon hara. Which is against the religion you profess to follow.
Ok, so as long as you agree that I am well justified in walking out, we can agree.
Don’t tell me about lashon hara. Go study the halachos and get back to me. Sheesh.
Good post, Heshy. Agree.
This is a frustration I share. I’ve never understood how a community that can, on the one hand, be so generous and hospitable, for example making sure that everyone, even some random stranger, has a place to go for a Shabbos or holiday meal, can on the other hand confer higher status on someone based on how many people’s homes that person won’t eat in. Makes me crazy.
I think it all comes down to insecurity. If you are secure in yourself you don’t need to put down others for trivial things. This to me is one of the biggest pieces of evidence that those who act that way are not where its at.
If the first thing the local non othodox crowd thinks when beeing around frum ppl is that they are rude, disgruntled, and inpatient you know that the community has largely failed.
I’m hungry.