Kelsey Media

Making fun of frum gays is fair game – or so I thought

98 comments

You may have noticed that I closed the comment for the post preceding this one and that’s because of the gays, yes finally I can be a real frummy and blame something on the gays, it’s not an earthquake or a tsunami, but it’s close! So I wrote the post as satire, I didn’t even write it, it was copied posted review of an eating healthy shabbaton (obese Jews who want to start controlling their chulent and deli roll intake) and reworded it a bit. Maybe if I would have included the link to the original people would have “got it”, but alas they didn’t.

Not only did most everyone who commented not get it, but they found it offensive. It just so happens to be that comments are a poor judge, I have noticed that when a hot topic post comes out, everyone encourages their friends to stick up for them in the comments section (check out the poking fun at sephardim post for a great example of people whop have never read this blog before – attacking me) and before long it turns into a heated debate. Many of the people commenting failed to realize that I have written dozens upon dozens of posts making fun of the frum communities homophobia and showing my support for those struggling with the enormous challenge of being frum and gay.

I make fun of everyone, but suddenly when I decided to make fun of the gays they felt hurt, saddened and felt the need to send me dozens of messages telling me why it’s different. Seemed like a double standard to me when I made the ranting video below, but I received a few messages telling me why it was different. That I was feeding the hate, they obviously haven’t read my piece on how the frum gay crowd will soon be into bestiality and the comments that followed. So am I feeding the hate, or showing that the hate is stupid.

One frum gay woman told me that it was different because there is a real fear amongst openly gay frum folks of other religious folks acting violently towards them and that’s pretty scary.

Here are some of the messages received:

Heshy,

I just read what you wrote on the Eshel Shabbaton. I know that you regard your blog as equal-opportunity satire/bashing or whatever, but I just would like to point out a couple of things, if I may, without hostility.

1) People read what you wrote and didn’t realize it was satire.

2) Many frum gay Jews face real danger every day of their lives. They face losing everything up to and including their lives for something which they did not choose.

3) Blood libels against Jews, that is, individual incitements based on false accusations of specific cases, often very obviously fabricated, lead to the deaths of thousands of Jews throughout the Middle Ages and beyond. None of these individual incitements were reasons on their own for the violence that they incurred, but rather provided a convenient excuse for people who were already inclined to harm us.

For a population so constantly under attack, I would, indeed, suggest that perhaps such a piece as the one you wrote is inappropriate and even dangerous. I can understand your thinking that this piece is balanced out by other things that you have written, but having heard some of the truly harrowing stories of the people I met at the Eshel Shabbaton, many of whom still live in hiding in their communities, I’m inclined to think that we are not yet in an age where we can take this lightly.

God willing we will soon be able to laugh about this… but for now I really think it is too painful and too dangerous. I hope you will take some time to consider what I’ve said, with the understanding that it is not my intention to attack. I’m not expecting a retraction or anything of the sort… I just want you to hear this, take it in, and think about it.

Thank you.

Another good one:

Heshy, I know you are supportive. I wrote that on my facebook page when I posted the article. I also know you are writing satire.

I think (and I could be wrong) that the difference is that this just feeds into a certain segment of the population’s fear and hatred of queer folks, and sort of riles them up. It makes me nervous, because crazy folks in the orthodox community (like Nate, possibly) were responsible for what happened in Tel Aviv.

It’s a really fine line when it comes to something that has the potential to push people’s buttons so strongly. While I recognize that you satirize people equally, I don’t think some hothead is going to bust into 770 and machine gun chassidim as a result of your Lubavitch satires. Whereas I am not as sure when it comes to queer folks.

I guess all I’m saying is “tread carefully”…

And yes, I appreciate your supportive posts, and your attitude in general.

My video rant:

  • Drew

    Funny that you never posted this video in a blog post:

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      Was posted when it first came out my friend

      • that was funny

        your argument about family and kids has nothing to do with sex. they could theoretically raise a family and kids with each other, they just cant have sex while doing so. this is an issue of people wanting to have sex a specific way, not people that want to raise a family.

  • Anonymous

    Video rant is missing.

    • http://michaltastik.com Michal

      Was that from a phone? Videos don’t come up from your phone.

  • itchiemayer

    Whoever didn’t realize it was satire is a damn fool.

  • elana

    I for one have seen much funnier posts here,and yesterdays blog didn’t really affect me one way or the other,maybe if I were gay I would have seen it differently,but knowing myself I probably wouldn’t have,we should all be able to laugh at ourselves at some point, or even at the way other people may look at a situation, I’m black (Heshy where is my guest post??) and I found those black frum cartoon rappers pretty darn funny,how come there were like maybe 10 comments when the hittler Bais Yachove video thing was posted? Really where was everybody then? The script was funny but the charactors were obscene!! So I watched it made a comment and moved on, no big deal. I think if you come to this site you should be prepared to be offended in some way at some time,not the “NATE” kind of offended but topics get pretty heated around here and it should be expected… If you are gay and you love G-D then keep on keeping on, your relationship with G-D is yours and nobody else’s . And I can’t spell I know…..

  • Vivian

    People always make fun of gay people, in the “fun” so many gay people get hurt, ask the poor teenager who’s dorm room mate made “fun” of him, all in the day for Satire eh?
    I think not, yes we are sensitive, why, because it happens to us all the time, every day.

    heshy, I am a fan, this cuts too close to the bone for me to find it funny.

    • Izzy

      You don’t need to dint it funny. I don’t find it funny when Heshy mocks groups I identify with either. But I don’t complain either. The fact that people are fine with a blog that mostly mocks various groups if Jews, until their particular group is locked, tells me that they have no appreciation for satire, just disdain for other Jews.

      • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

        Thank you for finally seeing that I really don’t dislike any one group – it’s collective mocking for the sake of laughter and thought, but I don’t have disdain.

  • Izzy

    Clearly a double standard here. I read the post and immediately realized it was satire, because Heshy used made up names, such as Pesach Krohns and Shloime Dachstein, as he typically does in his satire posts. For the record, the only post that was satire that I did not recognize as such was his post a while back about his sex life. Like all good satirists such as SNL, Colbert, South Park (all if which poke fun at gays, as well as Jews), Heshy is an equal opportunity offender. I’m surprised that he caved and closed the comments on the previous thread, though. I still think Nate should be banned though.

  • whoa5771

    Heshy, no one is gonna is burst into 770 and gun down lubabs
    but many people wouldnt be so distruaght if it happened either ;)

    • Anonymous

      That is such a sick comment…

      • whoa5771

        why? you dont agree? im pretty sure that the next moth after a gunning in 770 some rov in lakewoods yeshiva is going to say they had it coming for idolarty…

  • that was funny

    i havent been on your blog in a very very long time. i read your last piece with a mild level of amusement and didnt really laugh out loud, but when i got to the comments, WOW!! some of the funniest comments ive read ever. seriously hilarious. the goats part was seriously a laugh out loud event and made the whole thing worth reading.

    you are correct my friend, there certainly is a double standard. gays could bash the frum community all day every day but a single SATIRE blog cant post anything without them going ape. but i guess it makes sense that gay people would be more sensitive. they have got women and men that want to be women, put that together and youve got alot of bi*ching.

    • Bob

      The comments are always funnier than the blog. Frum satire hasnt been funny in a very long time (if that), the comments keep it going so everybody wins

  • http://quiet123@hotmail.com Avrumy

    Satire is one thing. Lies and defamation are another. Heshy, you have been a fair player on the frum gay issue, but something really creepy surfaced in your latest round of postings. And the scary people that popped out to comment made it even creepier. I am glad you are giving your actions the consideration it deserves.

    • that was funny

      yes yes scary and creepy. we are all going to have nightmares of heshy typing crap behind a computer screen. get a life dude.

  • Nate

    No worries Hesh, I busted my gut laughing and that is worth it. I’m not sure how I caused something in Tel Aviv, according to the letter write, I’ve never been to Israel, and truthfully I have no idea what happened there anyway. But, since rumor has it that Tel Aviv is a veritable Sodom & Gomorrah of immorality, maybe I should take credit for it.
    Now, about that goat….

  • Nate

    Hey where’s my comment? You are not seriously moderating me are you?

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      You are the first commenter ever to be moderated

      • that was funny

        wow chashuv.

  • Bridge and Tunnel

    I am an “undesirable” in the shidduch world and Heshy continues to mock girls in my situation – and the situation itself – on a constant basis.
    His satires and “fake” shidduch resumes seen in the frum dating world are hurtful to people like me, only promoting pity and often scorn.
    What if guys with machine guns bust into a singles shabbaton and kill all the older single girls bc of his posts, thinking they are solving the shidduch crisis by simply removing the “undesirables”?
    Heshy, your blog is a threat to the saftey of every single sect you mock! Every time you have the urge to write a frum statire, try and hold back – refrain from the cholent mocking – to help keep klal yisroel a safer and happier community.

    this was a lame attempt at satire bc HESHEY IS THE BEST AT WHAT HE DOES.

    • that was funny

      good job though, wasnt lol but a smile did run across my face.

      • Bridge and Tunnel

        Yay :)

    • Frozen Chosen

      Brava Bridge and Tunnel. You’ve got the most awesome comment of the day in my book

      • Bridge and Tunnel

        Thanks! I hope Heshy agrees lol.

  • Little Pom’s Mom

    I think in this case what determines if it was effective satire or inadvertant gay-bashing is the response you got from your straight commenters. If you had hit your mark, most of the comments would’ve been along the lines of “wow….people who are anti-gay are really lame!” It would’ve shown that they heard the satirical voice you used. But it seems to me like the bulk of the comments were more of the “gay people are gross” variety- which, IMHO, gives your GLBT readers some valid standing to say that you’re attempt at satire was more harmful than funny. Great satirical writing needs to make it’s point clearly, but with humor. I <3 you Heshy, but you fell short on this one; and when that happens *and* the subject is a population that is already oppressed and violently persecuted, they have every right to call you out on it.

    Better luck next time!

    • that was funny

      oppressed and violently persecuted? violently? really? wow, why do gay people have to be so apocalyptic. just say it how it is, “people hurt our feelings all the time hesh and we cry in bathrooms of our local synagagues.” saying that this is violent persecution is a bit of a push.

      • OutOfBounds

        The violent persecution is not a reference to words on a blog. The violent persecution is a reference to actual violent persecution. Gays and lesbians are regularly subject to physical violence and harassment for the mere fact of their actual or even just *perceived* sexual orientation. We’re not being apocalyptic, the danger is real. People may not have the right to expect that they will never have their feelings hurt, but the sort of hatred that has been expressed in the comments of the last post is indicative of, and perpetuating an attitude that underlies real violence in the real world.

        • that was funny

          well im surprised you speak up now. jews have been victims of violent persecution for centuries (ever heard of the holocaust?) and heshy makes fun of jews all the time, or have you not realized? so when it comes to a people who have been really persecuted, who basically define persecution, its a free for all to make fun of and you find it funny, but once we start making fun of the fact that you like taking it in the behind, then its wrong to make fun of a persecuted group?

          • OutOfBounds

            Have you ever heard of “too soon?”

            • that was funny

              too soon? to soon for what? when was the last time there was a massacre of gays that its too soon to start making fun of them after wards? more Jews have been killed in the past 10 years then gays. stop trying to get every ones sympathy. i have never heard of a terrorist blowing himself up in a gay bar. so its too soon to make fun of gays but jews haven’t been persecuted in about a week so lets make fun of them. stop with your hypocrisy.
              here are the statistics from a simple google search.
              “2008: 1,617 ate crime offenses based on sexual-orientation bias were reported by law enforcement agencies. ”
              “In 2009, 5,800 hate crimes were reported. Crimes against foreigners or with racist motives continue to dominate and the reporting of anti-Semitic crimes has increased,” the council said in a statement.”

            • that was funny

              do a google search for hate crimes against jews and those against gays, you will find that there are much more antisemitic hate crimes than there are gay hate crimes.

  • Frumsatire Fan

    Well, I didn’t complain about the post but, reactions aside, it wasn’t your funniest. If only you’d taken up my idea of gay honeypot kiruv, THAT would have been much better :)
    No big deal; it’s clear that it was satire, and as you said anyone who’s been reading you for a while knows that you’re sympathetic and a nice person.

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      It really wasn’t supposed to be that funny, I would say that 90% of my writing is not that funny, never was, it’s more of the type of humor that elicits smiles and head nods.

  • http://www.jewunderconstruction.com Elchanan

    I read your last post, and I thought it was extremely funny. I live outside of the frum community so I suppose to me it IS all a joke. However, as others above me have said, the beast lived in the comments. The hateful things people were saying. I mean, I’m used to being told I don’t deserve the right to marry or adopt children. Or that my actions are morally wrong… and I don’t hold that against them. I don’t judge them for those feelings. However when the anti-marriage bill passed in Wisconsin a flyer was posted all over my campus saying that “the time for the purging of these creatures will soon be under way”…. it hit home. Even at a liberal Lutheran college there were a group of people who advocated ending my life… and in the frum community there are so many more!

    • http://quiet123@hotmail.com Avrumy

      Elchanan, I hope you get to come to NY sometime and join the frumgay community we have here B”H.

      • that was funny

        there are so many more people that want to kill you in the frum community? really? again apocalyptic. its like you gays…i mean guys…crave the attention of being a persecuted group and are just starving for peoples pity. grow up. no one in the frum community is going to kill you. the most they’ll do is not invite you to the kiddush club.

        • http://quiet123@hotmail.com Avrumy

          Why not?

          • that was funny

            because kiddush club is macho not gay. plus, a guy might get reallydrunk and wake up with a sore tush if you know what i mean.

            • http://quiet123@hotmail.com Avrumy

              In your dreams… ;-)

              • che

                I’m pretty sure its your dreams buddy.

            • Frumsatire Fan

              Ok, I’m going to launch a twelve-step program for Straight Men to Overcome their Fear of Being Randomly S*domized. You can have that last l’chaim at the kiddush club. It just ain’t happenin, girlfriend.

              • che

                thats nother fear of ours. gay men wanting us to be there girfriends.

  • Jacob T

    The post was barely satire, and wasn’t funny. You’re often funny, and there’s no reason not to go after frum gays as well as everyone else. But if you’re going to do it, commit–go balls to the wall with ball jokes. Add something about checking your strap-on for shaatnez. Make it loud, abrasive, and hilarious. This was too close to what you might find on matzav to really be funny–it just came across as creepy and, therefore, more hurtful than it otherwise would have.

    • that was funny

      jacob, what was so creepy about it? please take out any particular sentence or paragraph from the post (not the comments) and tell us why you found it so offensive. my gosh, it was a joke about a gay shabbaton with a few gay sexual innuendos. if he wouldve said “all gays are fags” than i could hear what your saying (though that is a funny line).
      your problem wasnt the post since there was nothing in the post to get your panties in a twist (or whatever gay guys wear), your problem was that you were being picked on (sob, sob). well buckle up body, its heshy, hes a jerk, hes funny at times and hes entertaining to those of us bored out of our minds at work.
      just for a definition of satire:

      A literary work which belittles or savagely attacks its subject. A distinction is sometimes made between direct and indirect satire.
      courses.nus.edu.sg/course/ellibst/lsl01-tm.html

      it is what it is, live with it, if its ok to attack lubabs, sefardim, yeshivish people, israelis and just about every other group in the jewish world you could think of, then its ok to make fun of the fact that your a fagot and no one really likes you. now go to a gay meet in the city and discuss how your feelings were hurt and try to redefine what toeva means and then say its not any worse then speaking lashon hara, then get all nervous realizing that there are fundamental differences between the two, then get drunk and take it like a man or woman or however you like your alchoholic beverages…(what did you guys think i meant?)

      • Jacob T

        I didn’t say offensive, just not funny.

        “Billed as “two days that will nourish your body and soul”, the Eshel Shabbaton provided a pioneering program in the Jewish world – an inspiring and what some called “life-changing” Shabbos experience, focusing on healthy relationships and developing proper speaking techniques.”

        “The founders and directors of Eshel, offered in-depth and practical workshops for men and women on how to develop a healthy relationship with each other, as well as telling their own uplifting stories of struggles and success with being frum and gay. Shloime Dachsteins’ davening, kumzitz and Melava Malka concert added greatly to the ruchniyus and ruach.”

        “Rav Yisroel Salanter understood that if one’s health is compromised, then he cannot function properly, including his performance of mitzvos. Thus the enhancement of the neshoma is curtailed because of physical flaws in the human body! Rabbi Krohn posed the question, “Could it not be that after 120 years on the ultimate day of judgment, that we will be held responsible for our health issues if we were negligent (didn’t get married, didn’t have children, didn’t have sex with the one we loved etc.) because it led to a decrease in being able to perform mitzvos or study Torah?” Is it really worth it to refrain from love and true happiness?”

        These paragraphs are all, basically, straight (in comedic, not se3ual terms). The jokes were sprinkled in but most were too subtle (or oddly placed)–the end effect for many was a straightforward review of the Shabbaton with some very odd comments about cake thrown in. Unless the joke was that there was a gay frum shabbaton in the first place; but I don’t think Heshy believes that gay Orthodoxy is so outlandish as to be inherently funny. Bottom line, the piece wasn’t funny.

        As a side-note, I’m neither gay nor orthodox. My wife and I both go to an egal indy minyan.

      • Jacob T

        I didn’t say the post was offensive. I said it wasn’t very funny, and I stand by that. Whole swaths of it were written ‘straight’ (in the comedic use of the word), with nary a joke to be found. The few jokes that were sprinkled about were often too subtle to really get a laugh. So either Heshy had an off day, or he thought the whole premise of the shabbaton was so funny it didn’t need any extra jokes (that would be the part that might be hurtful).

        Either way, I like a lot of Heshy’s stuff and think that this post had potential, had he put enough jokes in for people to realize that it was, you know, humor.

        And not that it matters, but I’m straight and married. You don’t have to be gay to be disappointed by bad comedy.

        • that was funny

          i didnt say you said it was offensive, i said you said it was creepy and hurtful. to quote you “it just came across as creepy and, therefore, more hurtful than it otherwise would have.” so yea the difference between that and offensive is slight.

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      Actually I’m going to do a post based on your comment, thanks for the idea.

      • that was funny

        anytime…umm…what part?

  • Bubba Metzia

    :O, make fun of gay people? You can’t do that anymore than you can make fun of Sholom Rubashkin.

  • Guest

    I’m utterly opposed to attempts to legitimize a homosexual lifestyle, both in the Orthodox community, as well as in the world at large (but since the world at large doesn’t care what Orthodox Jews think, I see no point in spending too much time on this latter issue).

    That being said, I don’t think people should investigate into the private lives of others, including who they choose to date, sleep with or whatever. These issues are deeply personal, and should be left to the individual/families, and whatever friends that individual turns to for support.

    Additionally the distress that committed Jews who are gay feel is tremendous. In the least judgemental of orthodox communities, probably some of these people would still contemplate suicide, or become depressed, because of the realization that their orientation may render attempts at living a mainstream life very difficult to near-impossible. Think about it: a lot of these people, from a relatively tender age, face serious doubts about whether they will be able to marry, have children, fulfill romantic dreams, and continue to associate with family and friends, whom they love deeply. If they “come out” will they be rejected by everyone they love, even if they abstain from fulfilling their desires? If they abstain from fulfilling their desires, is this a recipe for life long misery? I’m not inclined to poke fun at people in this position, any more than I’m inclined to make fun of a schizophrenic (which many people do), or a person with Duchenne’s muscular dystrophy.

    Of course nobody’s perfect–we all screw up, and there are “612 other mitvos in the Torah,” but unfortunately transgressions in these areas are considered quite severe, so taking them lightly is problematic, and orthodox gays know this, which probably adds to the distress.

    So, yes, while there is in certain quarters a negative agenda to reshape society’s values away from disapproval of the classic arayot, an orthodox gay Jew is presumably aware that committed Jews aren’t in a position to do this. So the response to them should be one of empathy, including avoiding ridicule.

    Of course, you can make this case for a lot of other things Heshy satires on this blog, so he’ll have to decide just how much of a sensitive nice guy to be.

  • yitz

    HESH can u post a pix of two GIRLZ makin out???!!!!!!

  • Lirehagi

    I’m sorry if my trying to point out to certain commenters that they’d think of the issue differently if it were closer to home was offensive

  • Yoreh K’chetz

    Here we go again with the poor prosecuted gays, facing blood libels and possibly execution at the hands of talibanlike frummies.

    Enough with your sorry ass whining, frum people are just fed up with hearing it louder and louder with every passing week, symposiums, shabbatons. What’s next, a frum gay cruise? Or perhaps including incest and bestiality fetishes in the next eshel party?

    Helpless people deserve sympathy. People that are in a shitty situation due to no fault of their own, such as handicaps. The majority of you seem to have been stupid enough tho choose to “come out” in a frum, society that, for the most part, believes your acts are disgusting and view you as freaks.

    Most frum people have dedicated their lives to Judaism. Most of us make daily sacrifices in order to live and bring up our children as frum Jews. When you take it to the next step and try to hijack orthodoxy, don’t come crying when it backfires and you piss people off.

    Lastly, you aren’t any more special than anyone else. Bragging about your queer lifestyles will only turn you in the butt (pun intended) of our jokes.

    • John

      very very well said

      • che

        aiman.

  • http://boxedwhine.blogspot.com Boxed Whine

    Are comments screened here?

    • Bubba Metzia

      Only if your comment has a word that’s picked up by the filters. Otherwise they just get posted automatically without screening.

  • http://boxedwhine.blogspot.com Boxed Whine

    Let me try this again. At least something good came of this and Nate got banned. If he were not Jewish, I am sure that The Westboro Baptist Church would have a place for him.

    • that was funny

      oh yes, look at the enlightened liberal take pride in the control of free speech. you could say anything you want but he cant cause you dont like it?

  • Izzy (1)

    Hershey, the timing of your post yesterday was ironic. Our President took a very courageous step yesterday in his State of the Union speech last night. He publicly announced to America that gays will no longer have to hide their sexual orientation to serve in the armed services. It was sad to see the generals during the speech sitting there stoically and not even applauding.

    Perhaps someday, frum gays will be able to openly attend religious services in frum communities without feelings of impending persecution or rejection. One should not forget that during the Holocaust, gays of all religions were murdered with many of my frum relatives. There are many people in the world who would still applaud this. I think the frum Jewish community has a long way to go….but I’m convinced discussions like these help rather than harm. Nice follow-up post Hershey!

    • that was funny

      im not sure what your point was in bringing in the fact that hitler killed gays. even a broken clock is right twice a day. the torah says gay people deserve capital punishment.

      • Izzy

        You are clearly oblivious to inhumanity…..so you propose we do everything the Torah says to do? Is that how you live? Broken clocks are usually thrown away by people with common sense.

        • Nate

          “You are clearly oblivious to inhumanity…..so you propose we do everything the Torah says to do?”

          LMAO!

          Uh, yeah Beavis, thats precisely what we propose. Torah is by definition, humane. It defines what humane is and is not. And it does it way better than the US Constitution does.

          • Izzy (1)

            Uh, yeah Butthead, spoken like another “self-proclaimed” Torah scholar. I don’ t know too many Tzadiks that get moderated on Heshy’s blog….oh that’s right, you’re the only one. Based on the nature of your posts, your Talmudic heart lacks compassion and is full of hate. Your freedom to post your hate here is more a function of the US Constitution than the Talmud…so be it.

            • Nate

              We didnt say Naaseh v’Nishma only for the things we liked and felt good about. We accepted ALL of it.

          • S

            let’s all have slaves & get our dad drunk & get pregnant, shall we?! come on!

            • that was funny

              my gosh S, its not enough that you gay people want to have gay relations but now your proposing incest?
              oh wait your referring to lot? i get it, so you take something totally out of context and try to say that the torah encourages it.
              sharp (and extremely misleading and hypocritical) though why don’t we actually look at what the torah says about incest with ones father.
              oh wait it says the same thing it does about gay relations, wow thats amazing. wait no, the torah actually uses a stronger language against gay relations, that’s really fascinating.
              so im glad somebody finally admitted that “frum” gays dont actually care about what the torah says. about time you guys came out with it (pun totally intended)

              • S

                i’m not gay dumbass!

  • Satire implies….satire

    Let’s see if you can spot the joke in here:

    Gay people have sex that’s the same as beastiality or incest.
    Gay men lisp and talk funny.
    Gay men are effeminate.
    Gay men have sex with other men.
    How do you know Avraham was down with the gays? He tried to save Sodom!

    Ok, maybe it’s not FUNNY. But can you spot the difference between the item that is actually a joke and the offensive stereotypes?

    Heshy, sometimes I wonder if you understand that “satire” is not the same thing as “making fun of” something. Satiring gays is not the same thing as listing a bunch of stereotypes and incorporating them into a ‘news item’, because “ha-ha-ha doesn’t everyone understand that when *YOU* say it, it is funny, but when *OTHER* people say it, they are being homophobic.”

    Your video rant is not up, so I have no idea if by printing these letters you’re actually interested in showing any contrition for YOUR part in perpetuating the same bullshit stereotypes against The Gays under the naive misconception that you are actually being satirical or if you are trying to simply say, “Hey, here is another viewpoint. Get a load of how overly sensitive The Gays are! Am I right? What a bunch of p*ssies. Or not. Because they like d*ck. Ha!”

    I know you think you are very different from THOSE anti-gay frummies, because “Hey, some of my best friends are gay! I love Gays!” The fact that you’re not a creepy violent homophobe doesn’t absolve you of the damage done by your own need to broadcast stereotpyical gay-bashing drivel that is *supposed* to be satire, except forgot to satirize.

    • that was funny

      wow you are really really really slow arent you? is all the semen up your tush affecting your brain cells?

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      Suck my dick

      • that was funny

        i hope your referring to the “satire’ poster dude cause i don’t swing that way dude. im sure he’ll do it with pleasure though.

  • PrettyBoyFloyd

    If being a frum homosexual is fine, then why did everyone attack Chaim Weingarten for Shtupin his daughter??? After all, incest and homosexuality is in the same Parsha.

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      Rape is much different my friend

      • that was funny

        otherwise it would be ok?

        • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

          I don’t see why not – I find golden showers pretty gross, but banning them is ridiculous – one mans porn is another mans puke bag

  • Bob

    Too Funny

  • Nate

    Just watched Hesh on the Mikva Night video. You’re funny Hesh. And owned. LOL.

  • Frummer

    As a irregular follower here, I have to say, I like most of what I read here and when I dont, I stop reading. Either way, I think Hesh is the best!
    I dont think the previous gay-shabbaton post was particularly great or funny piece. Just the fact that there are people who think that being frum & openly gay is possible cracks me up. (Yes, I have read ALL the comments and that there are 612 other mitzvos.) Its just too ironic that people can still be trying to justify something that is a complete oxymoron by definition.

  • Chill Out!

    Folks you’re all here to read SATIRE. It’s in the title of the webpage for crying out loud! If not you wouldn’t visit this site. Do you really expect to read something here about your own “sect” and not have something hit home? That’s what Heshy does! Pardon the pun, but the gays are getting very anal because Heshy picked on them. I am firmly entrenched in the “frummy” crowd and I get a kick out of Heshy’s postings, especially when it’s something that I can relate to and points somewhat at me. I read this purely for entertainment, because I know he isn’t being serious and means no harm or ill will towards me. And Heshy – you gotta man up. Why do you feel the need to defend yourself from a bunch of paranoid people? It’s no secret that ALL types of Jews have been persecuted, murdered, etc throughout history. Does that mean if one of your posts hits home with me and my “type” I all of a sudden have to worry that someone is going to come after me? Heck Jews have suffered alot more than gays throughout history, we are a resilient people. We do our thing because we are chosen by G-d and don’t give a damn about what the rest of the world says. If they had their way we’d have been wiped from the face of the earth thousands of years ago. I wish the gay people, especially being that you’re Jewish here, would take a lesson from that and just march on and stop making a fuss when you don’t like the way someone writes or looks at you.

  • Avrumy

    Heshy – just watched your video. You are still supercool in my book. And looking mighty fine.
    I am possibly your #1 frum gay fan. So, what are you doing Saturday night? :-)

  • Yoreh K’chetz

    Any post relating to gays seem to consistently generate the most comments, whether serious, sad or funny. I’m wondering why…

    May it be:

    a) A disproportionate amount of faygels reading your blog.
    b) A disproportionate amount of faygels activists reading your blog.
    c) A disproportionate amount of liberals (faygel+activist) reading your blog.
    d) Hesh living in the San Fran area thereby generating gay karma.
    e) Liberal f@g activists pissing off the rest of the frum readership.
    f) All of the above.

    • Frozen Chosen

      Off the derech topics are a close second. I think you’ve figured it out, d) all that gay Bay area karma

  • Anonymous

    Heshy how can you (generally speaking of course) be frum and have a gay partner when it is clearly assur? Please dont write back how can you be frum and speak loshon hara? It is totally different i dont choose a lifestyle of speaking loshon hara i try not to anfd try to follow shulchan aruch as much as i can and if io slip i must repent but someone who chooses a GAY lifestyle and chooses to sin is not a frum person just like the guy who chooses to speak loshon hara for a living is not frum. I honestly want to know what you think thank you.

    • http://quiet123@hotmail.com Avrumy

      The irony, of course, is that no one chooses to be gay. However, we do choose to be orthodox. The question is why a gay person would choose to be orthodox when s/he has to constantly deal with opinions like yours. Yes, yes, you are basing your opinions on generally-accepted halacha. But you are also assuming that all frum gay people are intentionally violating halacha. We gay folks have to deal with the halacha (d’oraissa and d’rabbanan) as best we can without condemning ourselves to loveless, lonely lives. If you or the rabbis have a problem with that, the problem is yours. If you just don’t like gays, that is your problem, too.

      • Yoreh K’chetz

        Avrumy,

        While you may not have chosen your orientation, you chose to “come out”. You did so knowing that there would be consequences, such as being ostracized, being made fun of, being refused entry to shuls, mikvahs or whatever else “persecution” you currently suffer because of your choice.

        While your Shabbaton may have been fun a nice for you and your buddies, in my opinion, it will only make things worse for your kind throughout the rest of the frum world. Same will Israeli pride parades, and the various other recent attempts at trying to convince the frum world (including yourselves) that what you guys do is “OK”.

        The backlash you see here (and mostly everywhere else) has nothing to do with hating gays. It’s got everything to do with hating the gay assault on Judaism.

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      I honestly have no idea, I’m not frum

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  • rationalist frummie

    what “assault” are you referring to?

    • Yoreh K’chetz (aka Phil)

      Rationalist,

      I’m referring to the barrage of recent tactics to legitimize gay behavior within Judaism.

      Things like the Y.U. symposiom, the Boteach article, the push for a recognition “ceremony” (with or without vows), eshel type videos about how “it’s OK” or “it gets better”, the dating site for “frum f@gs” and now, the shabbaton.

      We even have one activist in Montreal that’s been campaigning to try to have a modern orthodox rabbi perform some kind of marriage, even though he’s already had the reform clowns do it for him, and the guy isn’t religious in the least bit.

      Well, I’ve got news. It ain’t happening, not in my lifetime, nor anyone else’s. Ture Torah Jews will not accept or condone this perverted lifestyle, which Halacha equates with consentual incest and bestiality.

    • that was funny

      just do a simple google search buddy.

  • DF

    I don’t understand why a Gay person can’t get married and have a family. You say – “They want to have children” etc. – Well let them!

    Who is putting a gun to a gay guys head and telling them not to get married and have children? So they wont enjoy the sex?

    I’m so sorry.

    Don’t even think of telling me that it’s gross to them – I won’t buy it. I don’t want to get too graphic…

    They won’t have a sex life?

    As a frum person you wouldn’t have much of a sex life anyway. You can’t mess around while your single and once your married there are tons of laws getting in the way.

    Plus you can always take care of yourself (Not 100% Kosher – but living with the opposite gender is not really either)

    A gay person can’t “love” someone from the opposite gender? I’m lost.

    I’m frum and I haven’t had full on sexytime yet – I’m not running around screaming and crying – I haven’t been in love yet either – big freaking deal!

    You can love. You can have children. You can get married. You just don’t want to. You would rather make noise. That’s how I understand it.

    What makes your sexuality the biggest issue in your life? Go work. Have fun. (Even have gay sex – everyone breaks some laws) Do your Jewish thing. Do whatever you want – in fact go marry a guy – just quite down already.

    I don’t run around stuffing my sexual preferences in your face – get out of mine.

    Thank you.

    The man has ranted.

    • http://www.frumsatire.net Heshy Fried

      But everyone stuffs their orientation in the face of gays without realizing it or not. Hang out with someone who’s in the closet that you know is gay and then you’l realize that most of life is about sex, marriage and dating – unless you happen to be a blogger who;s an outdoors nut

  • jimmy

    You know the idea of the Big Lie. You hear it so often, you begin to believe it, especially if others around you believe it.

    The Left has been pushing homosexuality and transsexualism as “normal” since the 60s. TV shows, personalities, interviews. Everything has been done to promote this as just another way of having sex and coupling, and people that are homosexual or transsexual are just like you and me, no problem.

    Of course, nothing could be further from the truth. Homosexuality is a mental disease. It’s not just about sex, it’s about emotional fulfillment, too. Taken to its logical extreme, homosexuality and transsexualism will destroy a species. The first mitzvah is reproduction. Heterosexual couples are the norm in the Torah from the beginning.

    I really don’t care what two adults do together, but I don’t want them telling me they’re normal and should be treated like everyone else. If you want to do what you want, you have to be prepared to suffer the consequences.

  • Guy Upstairs

    Your video rant was poignant and effective. It always impresses me when you refrain from cursing, but when you refrain from DROOLING–now THAT gets my attention. Well done, sir, well done.