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	<title>Comments on: Mechitza&#160;Guide</title>
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	<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/</link>
	<description>It aint always frum and it aint always satire</description>
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		<title>By: HannahBanana</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-87047</link>
		<dc:creator>HannahBanana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:12:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-87047</guid>
		<description>Phil,

I&#039;m the only one I ever have spoken for, but you&#039;d have to be insane to think anyone on earth is a &quot;pure&quot; anything. That&#039;s absurd and statistically extremely unlikely. There&#039;s always a wondering salesman, or a Mongol hoard or something. 

As to mixing milk and meat, yes, there are reasons not to. Archeology has found that many of the Jewish dietary laws had a valid basis in health. That said, let&#039;s be fair, you yourself admit you&#039;re pretty much a binary thinker who can&#039;t form an argument without personal attacks, so there really is no reason for me to continue this debate. So, if you want to respond, feel free, but frankly this is boring me now, and your arguments of &quot;nuh uh!&quot; are worn out. 

Later!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil,</p>
<p>I&#8217;m the only one I ever have spoken for, but you&#8217;d have to be insane to think anyone on earth is a &#8220;pure&#8221; anything. That&#8217;s absurd and statistically extremely unlikely. There&#8217;s always a wondering salesman, or a Mongol hoard or something. </p>
<p>As to mixing milk and meat, yes, there are reasons not to. Archeology has found that many of the Jewish dietary laws had a valid basis in health. That said, let&#8217;s be fair, you yourself admit you&#8217;re pretty much a binary thinker who can&#8217;t form an argument without personal attacks, so there really is no reason for me to continue this debate. So, if you want to respond, feel free, but frankly this is boring me now, and your arguments of &#8220;nuh uh!&#8221; are worn out. </p>
<p>Later!</p>
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		<title>By: DrumIntellect</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-87041</link>
		<dc:creator>DrumIntellect</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 16:22:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-87041</guid>
		<description>Agreed. 

Plus, it was a good place to read. 

And, they often had better chairs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed. </p>
<p>Plus, it was a good place to read. </p>
<p>And, they often had better chairs.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-87032</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 14:18:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-87032</guid>
		<description>Hannah, 

Speak for yourself. Halacha assumes Jews to come from pure lineage and valid converts unless there is a valid reason to think otherwise.

And yes, much of halacha is based on binary logic, sometimes looking outdated, or not fully understandable. Those are called Chukim.

Can you give me any &quot;valid&quot; reason not to wear Shaatnez or mix milk and meat besides the Torah saying so? I doubt it.

If feeling good is all that religion is about, we might as well become rastafarians, sit on the beach and smoke dope all day. Sounds like more fun than Yom Kippur.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hannah, </p>
<p>Speak for yourself. Halacha assumes Jews to come from pure lineage and valid converts unless there is a valid reason to think otherwise.</p>
<p>And yes, much of halacha is based on binary logic, sometimes looking outdated, or not fully understandable. Those are called Chukim.</p>
<p>Can you give me any &#8220;valid&#8221; reason not to wear Shaatnez or mix milk and meat besides the Torah saying so? I doubt it.</p>
<p>If feeling good is all that religion is about, we might as well become rastafarians, sit on the beach and smoke dope all day. Sounds like more fun than Yom Kippur.</p>
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		<title>By: A. Nuran</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-87024</link>
		<dc:creator>A. Nuran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 13:11:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-87024</guid>
		<description>So are Larry Craig and Ted Haggard</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So are Larry Craig and Ted Haggard</p>
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		<title>By: HannahBanana</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-86972</link>
		<dc:creator>HannahBanana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:22:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-86972</guid>
		<description>Phil, 

Your concept of debate doesn&#039;t seem to follow what&#039;s called &quot;logic.&quot; Do you follow EVERYTHING halachic? Every single law, at all times? I&#039;m guessing not, unless you read &quot;The Year of Living Biblically&quot; and felt that was your calling. Not even the Vilna Goan could do it. 

Am I saying that since you can&#039;t follow everything, you should follow nothing? No. But there needs to be room for debate and logic and disagreement. Your type of binary logic is a primary reason why a lot of us have moved away from Orthodoxy, and more toward Conservative. Does it follow &quot;the yoke&quot;? Meh, I guess not. But I love being Jewish, and I&#039;m a lot happier than I would be if I had to sit on some balcony and explain to my daughter why G-D doesn&#039;t want her daddy to be near her. 

As to what happens when Dov brings home Daisey, well, I would imagine that we would have fewer genetic disorders for one thing. For another, I think you should take a look in the mirror... whatever color you are, I&#039;m guessing it&#039;s the result of GENERATIONS of intermarriage and conversion when your Jewish ancestors got to their final destination and met the rest of the family tree. Unless your family has lived in Israel since King David, you, my friend, are the result of a break in halacha somewhere along the way. 

So, without a break in the law, you wouldn&#039;t be here... there&#039;s a double-edged sword for ya!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, </p>
<p>Your concept of debate doesn&#8217;t seem to follow what&#8217;s called &#8220;logic.&#8221; Do you follow EVERYTHING halachic? Every single law, at all times? I&#8217;m guessing not, unless you read &#8220;The Year of Living Biblically&#8221; and felt that was your calling. Not even the Vilna Goan could do it. </p>
<p>Am I saying that since you can&#8217;t follow everything, you should follow nothing? No. But there needs to be room for debate and logic and disagreement. Your type of binary logic is a primary reason why a lot of us have moved away from Orthodoxy, and more toward Conservative. Does it follow &#8220;the yoke&#8221;? Meh, I guess not. But I love being Jewish, and I&#8217;m a lot happier than I would be if I had to sit on some balcony and explain to my daughter why G-D doesn&#8217;t want her daddy to be near her. </p>
<p>As to what happens when Dov brings home Daisey, well, I would imagine that we would have fewer genetic disorders for one thing. For another, I think you should take a look in the mirror&#8230; whatever color you are, I&#8217;m guessing it&#8217;s the result of GENERATIONS of intermarriage and conversion when your Jewish ancestors got to their final destination and met the rest of the family tree. Unless your family has lived in Israel since King David, you, my friend, are the result of a break in halacha somewhere along the way. </p>
<p>So, without a break in the law, you wouldn&#8217;t be here&#8230; there&#8217;s a double-edged sword for ya!</p>
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		<title>By: kissmei'mshomer</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-86925</link>
		<dc:creator>kissmei'mshomer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:57:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-86925</guid>
		<description>&quot;95% of orthodox Women come to shul once a week, does that mean we should have the bimah in the middle for once a week shul goers. Besides, most women don’t come on time, and the shuls where women come more often usually have the bimah in the center of the shul.&quot;

I think this a chicken-and-egg thing. In my opinion, when a shul&#039;s bimah is set up in the men&#039;s section, the message that is communicated is that this shul is a man&#039;s domain and responsibility and that women are guests who are allowed to watch. I think that it would only be a natural consequence for men to then make more of an effort than women to come on time. 
Perhaps if men and women davened side by side, with the bima and aron in the middle, both men and women would feel that they are being equally represented and that they are both equally important in shul, and both would take it as seriously. 
 However, mainstream Orthodoxy don&#039;t believe that men and women are equal in shul - it believes that men have the obligation and responsibility to attend (and thereby its associated privileges that come along with, i.e. aliyot, leining, being part of minyan etc.) whereas women don&#039;t (which comes along with the freedom of sleeping late but the consequence of not counting for minyan, not getting aliyot, and often not really getting to see what&#039;s going on.) 
I am not going to even debate whether or not I agree with the mainstream Orthodox view - I&#039;m just saying what I think the Orthodox view is.  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;95% of orthodox Women come to shul once a week, does that mean we should have the bimah in the middle for once a week shul goers. Besides, most women don’t come on time, and the shuls where women come more often usually have the bimah in the center of the shul.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think this a chicken-and-egg thing. In my opinion, when a shul&#8217;s bimah is set up in the men&#8217;s section, the message that is communicated is that this shul is a man&#8217;s domain and responsibility and that women are guests who are allowed to watch. I think that it would only be a natural consequence for men to then make more of an effort than women to come on time.<br />
Perhaps if men and women davened side by side, with the bima and aron in the middle, both men and women would feel that they are being equally represented and that they are both equally important in shul, and both would take it as seriously.<br />
 However, mainstream Orthodoxy don&#8217;t believe that men and women are equal in shul &#8211; it believes that men have the obligation and responsibility to attend (and thereby its associated privileges that come along with, i.e. aliyot, leining, being part of minyan etc.) whereas women don&#8217;t (which comes along with the freedom of sleeping late but the consequence of not counting for minyan, not getting aliyot, and often not really getting to see what&#8217;s going on.)<br />
I am not going to even debate whether or not I agree with the mainstream Orthodox view &#8211; I&#8217;m just saying what I think the Orthodox view is.  <img src='http://www.frumsatire.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-86921</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:43:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-86921</guid>
		<description>Hannah,

Your idea of religion doesn&#039;t seem to follow what&#039;s described as the &quot;yoke of Torah&quot;. 

What happens when Hymie brings Kristy to meet his parents instead of Sadie? Do you expect them to have a warm fuzzy interfaith ceremony?
(not trying to compare mechitza to intermarriage).

What about when Mushky is making a communal seder for 300 people and a tiny bit of chametz falls into the stew? Do you think she&#039;d feel warm and fuzzy about having to start over from scratch?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hannah,</p>
<p>Your idea of religion doesn&#8217;t seem to follow what&#8217;s described as the &#8220;yoke of Torah&#8221;. </p>
<p>What happens when Hymie brings Kristy to meet his parents instead of Sadie? Do you expect them to have a warm fuzzy interfaith ceremony?<br />
(not trying to compare mechitza to intermarriage).</p>
<p>What about when Mushky is making a communal seder for 300 people and a tiny bit of chametz falls into the stew? Do you think she&#8217;d feel warm and fuzzy about having to start over from scratch?</p>
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		<title>By: HannahBanana</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-86897</link>
		<dc:creator>HannahBanana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:59:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-86897</guid>
		<description>Phil, 

Name-calling aside, my point is this: yes. I disagree. I also disagree that tearing toilet paper consists of &quot;breaking&quot; shabbos.  I think that the point of any religion, but more specifically Judaism, is to bring communities and families together. It should be what binds us into a people, generation after generation. It should be a loving, warm blanket that we place on the shoulders of our children... I cannot believe that HaShem means for us to tear families apart the minute we enter schul. I understand what the tzadikkim say, but it&#039;s possible for people to be wise, and still be incorrect. That&#039;s my opinion: that it becomes exponentially harder to say that this is a religion of love and family, when the one place that should be the *most* family oriented insists on segregating the key components. 

But, like Heshy said, that&#039;s why I don&#039;t go to a schul with a mechitza.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, </p>
<p>Name-calling aside, my point is this: yes. I disagree. I also disagree that tearing toilet paper consists of &#8220;breaking&#8221; shabbos.  I think that the point of any religion, but more specifically Judaism, is to bring communities and families together. It should be what binds us into a people, generation after generation. It should be a loving, warm blanket that we place on the shoulders of our children&#8230; I cannot believe that HaShem means for us to tear families apart the minute we enter schul. I understand what the tzadikkim say, but it&#8217;s possible for people to be wise, and still be incorrect. That&#8217;s my opinion: that it becomes exponentially harder to say that this is a religion of love and family, when the one place that should be the *most* family oriented insists on segregating the key components. </p>
<p>But, like Heshy said, that&#8217;s why I don&#8217;t go to a schul with a mechitza.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2010/03/18/mechitza-guide/comment-page-1/#comment-86884</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:31:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=4598#comment-86884</guid>
		<description>Hannah,

OK, maybe freak was a bit harsh. 

If you think that shuls shouldn&#039;t have mechitzas and men should rather be forced to concentrate, you&#039;re disagreeing with the halachic authorities, not with me.

If these tzadikkim knew that mixing men and women would distract them, how much more so would it distract plain everyday guys like us?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hannah,</p>
<p>OK, maybe freak was a bit harsh. </p>
<p>If you think that shuls shouldn&#8217;t have mechitzas and men should rather be forced to concentrate, you&#8217;re disagreeing with the halachic authorities, not with me.</p>
<p>If these tzadikkim knew that mixing men and women would distract them, how much more so would it distract plain everyday guys like us?</p>
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