I am sure I will miss a few terms, but there are some general terms that I hear quite often in the shidduch world. I just got back into the whole mix of things so I am sure I will be hearing loads of things like “out of the box” and “open minded” but what most people don’t understand, or wish to think about- is what these terms really mean. It’s a shame I have been out of the shidduch scene for the past year – but I sure some of these still apply.
Not your typical: Whenever someone starts off their sentence describing themselves or someone else with “not your typical” it is usually being used to describe someone from Brooklyn or New York who seems to think they have an out of town attitude. The problem is, these not your typical types are almost always typical, so typical that you think these people should learn the halachos of placing stumbling blocks in front of your fellow Jew.
Out Of Town: this term is completely dependent on who is using it. If the person using the term to describe someone is from town (my definition being anywhere within 30 minutes of a kosher pizza store) then you are screwed because their ideas of what out of town attitudes are, are based on no personal experience- and don’t tell me that visiting day is counted.
Comes from a good family: Ok what are they hiding!
Modern: Less frum then the person describing them.
Frum But With It: If they say it I want nothing to do with it. Never really understood what this term meant. What exactly are you with? Who are you with? Does it mean that if you aren’t with it you are something other then frum?
Open minded: Either they went off the derech at some point, went to a college that isn’t the norm or has parents that are BT’s.
She really likes to talk: she’s a real bitch
She’s nice, She has such a big heart, She’s super sweet, really good personality: All backhanded ways to describe ugly girls.
She wants to live out of town: After two years she will demand that you move to within walking distance of her parents in Flatbush.
She carries herself so well: She’s huge
She’s so aidel: As long as you don’t find out about her year at Michlelet Esther.
She’s beautiful: If it’s a man telling you this they will usually be telling the truth, with women you can never be sure. Be sure to ask if they mean on the inside or out?
She’s from a yichusdike family: That already sounds way too frum. I come from yichus, but it’s not really important to anyone outside of Chassidic community.
Anyone interested in writing a similar post from a womans perspective?
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{ 37 comments… read them below or add one }
That’s a great list – really comprehensive! I’ve also been fed this one “He’s brilliant!” – This usually means that he probably cannot string together a coherent sentence.
And which terms, if any, would you find unambiguous?
“She carries herself so well: She’s huge”
That is sooo true…
Thanks FS for another great post:)
I’m confused these terms arent ambigous, they are just “code words” for saying things nicely you as well as anybody who has been in shiduchim for a little bit fully understands them, how would you like huge girls to be described?
These are so true. If a guy is setting a guy up he will say straight up if the girl is good looking or not. As will a girl who knows men. I have made four matches and the first thing I tell the guys I set up is how the girl looks because guys can get past most things if the girl is good looking. Girls usually have the hang ups about nonsense and here are a few I’ve compiled:
Is he ambitious: meaning will he make enough money for me to live in luxury so I do not have to work?
How frum is he: Is he shomer negiah?
Does he work out: Is he fat?
Does he have hair: Is he bald?
(if he’s from out of Bklyn) Will he move back to California (or wherever he is from): Will he live next door to my mommy and daddy in Bklyn, LI, NJ etc?
(if he’s from NY and she is not) Does he want to live in NY forever: I only moved to NY to find a guy the second after the chuppah I am jetting back to obscure village where I hail from.
Is he put together: Does he know how to dress? Wear matching socks? Does he clip his fingernails/nose hair/ear hair?
Does he wear glasses: If he does, they better not be nerdy glasses.
Is he outgoing: Will he talk over me and take the spotlight from me?
These are usually the questions I get from guys:
Is she hot: Is she hot?
Is she pretty: Is she pretty?
Is she shomer negiah: Will she fool around (this question is only asked by frummy guys)
Deb, great comment, almost a post in itself!
Definitely a post in itself
oh dear more silly labels, mostly derogatory, i went last night to a melave malke at the Yeminite Minyan NYC heard a great lecture on the topic of recently discovered manuscripts, there were temani, askenazi, separhdi, mizrach, beards ,payot, kippah sevruga, velvet yeshivish, black hats, sheitels,singles were fat skinny pretty smart stupid fat ugly girls/ guys, go do something you enjoy and you will likely meet someone with the same interests then you can use your “labels” to judge whether or not to approach them, get out of your own box, tons of great people out there. Raquelle.
i counted 18 labels in Raquelle’s comment, how many can you find?
i count 19! #18 “get out of your own box” #19 “great people”!
hey hesh have you heard about the show srugim I saw something about it in the jewish weak and wondered what you thought
great show must see
you think I live in a cave?
i live in a cave. what are you talking about?
Ambiguous terms used to describe guys: A girl’s perspective
Comes from a good family – What else do you need to know??
1) He’s modern – Is attending Touro college
2) He’s a little stocky – The floorboards tremble under his tread
3) You might want to do something with your hair – Actually, he wanted to know what your bra-size was
4) He works – Occasional handy-man/all around guy for the local Chabad House
5) He’s a really interesting person – Did time in jail
6) He’s college educated- …but plans to embark on a Kollel/Kiruv career
7) He’s not a learning guy – Thinks there are four sides in a triangle
9) He’s open minded – Has read Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, and occasionally listens to Yanni.
10) What you see is what you get – A conversation about the weather is deep
11) He needs a woman to bring him out a little – you might only see the top of his Borcellino
12) He knows what he wants – He is famous for not calling girls back.
13) He’s a great guy – just be aware that there are throngs of girls waiting in the wings…
14) He’s really special – usually reserved for guys who grew up in a tricky family situation.
15) He’s really Chassidish – By the second date, you need to talk tachlis!
Another awesome comment!
i really like your list devorah! although i do have some reservations about it! see im college educated, i do learn some but i dont plan on doing it long teerm..so im what you might call a non-learning guy! and i forsure as hell know there are TWO sides too a triangle not 4!!! p.s. i dont plan to do kollel or kiruv..
I know, I know, just expressing a little frustration that you can sit and talk to and get to know a shadchan for 3 hours, and they still just don’t “get it”, they will take some arbitrary, skin deep quality or acitivity that he does and say “See? he’s a modern, open-minded guy!”
Just by the way, in this context, “not a learning type” is usually taken to mean “not an intellectual/bookish type”, rather than “kollel type.”
oh k… im from a more “yeshivish background so when i see the word “learning” i think torah or at least jewish studies! and vice versa i associate the word studying non-jewish studies,i.e. college,etc..
so you see, this alone is an example of why labels are necessary !
I accidentally told a girl that the guy I was setting her up with was interesting. She became very suspicious and started drilling me about everything I knew about him. But I really meant it! He is interesting, meaning he always have interesting and intelligent insights on almost every topic, he has an interesting background and found his own way into a torah observant lifestyle, he is intelligent and social, but also reserved and scholarly. I finally got through to her that “interesting” is not a bad thing, but it did take some damage control!
LOL
People are weird!
He likes to have a good time – He is a sex offender.
He is in good shape – He is balding and has a protruding beer belly.
He looks good for his age – he is old enough to pass for your father.
He is very outgoing – He is not interested in your opinions.
He is adventurous – He goes to strip clubs.
He is an open minded intellect – He is a Democrat liberal.
He is generous – He is cheap.
dear john sorry my ironic tone re labels didn’t translate to email, what i meant was just go and do something involving jewish learning you like and you might very well meet someone with the same interests, take a chance!
Who said I don’t meet loads of interesting people – the whole point of this blog is to laugh at our own stupidity.
16) His father has a good kopp for business – He’s from a rich family, go for it!
anyone ever heard the question: “does she have a back porch?”
Not in context of a shidduch, but yes I’ve heard it.
He’s really good-looking. He’s a BT and makes really good money…
“AND?”
He has a job problem…
“in other words, he’s working on Shabbos?”
I still remember being in yeshiva for the year about 20 years ago, and we were all playing basketball. One of the NYers described someone from Chicago or something as an “out-of-towner.” I looked at him and said, “We’re in Israel now. We’re all out-of-towners!”
when i was in yeshiva in baltimore, we’d call the baltimoreans out-of-towners. I dont really get youre point, theres no question theres a difference between brooklyn (in town) and pretty much everywhere else. Just read many of the blogs on FS and comments on virtually all of them. Virtually all posts have a comment or 2 pointing out how brooklyn is scum for thinking we are better than “out-of-towners” (hope you like irony). these are just labels used to describe different groups, see post on labels Heshi (for once) had a good point about why labels are neccesary, as did most commenters
i just laugh whenever i hear someone use the term out-of-town in any context whatsoever!!!
it just goes to shows the haughty, selfish, “the world evolves around me”ness of Brooklyn people! ive lived in monsey for roughly 6-7 yrs now, and in the past year alone ive been to Brooklyn more times than all of the 5yrs before!! such a dreadful place!!! i swear some of these people are just nuts, for example when i tell some of them that im from belgium, their response goes something like this; “oh so you’re from the west coast? cali?” or better yet “i heard thats a city in england, no wait france?”
is it too much to ask for a new yorker to learn some geography? when i grew up, i learned the european geography(countries capitals,rivers,etc..) AS WELL AS american states and capitals!!!!!
Dont be so mad, as a resident of monsey, if you promise to think of belgium for now on only as a description of waffles, i think we can make you an honorary in-towner.
Look on google images for the famous New Yorker cover entitled “A New Yorker’s View of the world as Seen from Ninth Avenue” its hanging on my wall
thanx but no thanks, i’ll stick with being just me!
oh and thanx for the link,…ive heard of this cover before but never actually seen it!! i love it!
I know where Belgium is. But here’s something worse…I’m from San Diego, and someone thought I was talking about the one in Texas. San Diego, CA is ONLY the sixth largest city in the US!
how many hours do people from belgium wait between milchigs and fleishigs?
I got that backwards. You know what I meant. lol.
most ppl i know wait the standard(and i use that term loosely) 51/2-6hr…but in holland which is another country right across the border most ppl wait 1hr!