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Making fun of Baal Teshuva girls

bt girlsI have been getting quite a bit of mail lately asking for me to write down my thoughts on Baal Teshuva girls. These people say that I always write about guys, but never about girls this should seem obvious, but I know more about BT guys, I can spot them based on their dress, davening mannerisms and how they talk. I am sure girls do the same thing, I will attempt to write something.

I should really title this post, why I dont write about BT girls

Girls becoming frum is an interesting progression, many of the girls I have watched drink the punch and take the plunge did it because they didnt want to be considered a sex object. This is great, because it means more hot girls are coming into the fold. Other reasons girls become frum, are because they babysat way too often at their local chabad or they found the beauty in lighting candles, girls who become frum based on Friday night candle lighting must feel duped when they realize single guys light candles too (I mean the kiruv folks kind of advertise candle lighting as this beautiful womans mitzvah and all)

The first thing that girls do when they start contemplating frumkeit, is go on one of those bribery based trips run by aish or chabad. They show you the beauty of being frum while shuttling you around Israel for 99 bucks. Just 2 weeks of Jewel can change a girls life forever. They suddenly return to their college campus wearing skirts, refraining from hugging their guy friends and deleting all their party pictures from facebook. If this is not backed up by a healthy dose of campus kiruv or local chabad, it usually ends by the time you realize that long sleeves in the summer dont work too well.

I always marveled at the girls who understood the subtleties of frum society when they were first becoming frum. I love watching girls who hide the fact they are going out after havdalah or they start hiding their arms at chabad, but when they see the Rabbi walking around they duck behind a tree.

This is a very random ideas all over the place post by the way.just warning you.

The worst kind of BT is the shomer negiah intensive BT girl. Girls and guys alike feel that this is the thing to start off with first. I have met girls who dont keep shabbos, eat meat and milk, but they are strictly shomer negiah. Then you have those girls that will hook up with you and then tell you that they dont want you watching movies with untznius girls in them.

BT girls shuckel like men when they daven. They usually dont realize that its frum women dont shuckel when davening, they sway or do side to side shuckels. BT girls also love to bury their face in their siddur, which is a problem because they usually dont know the words yet.

What about BT girls and the two facebook profile phenomena? I know quite a few girls who have two Facebook profiles, one for their old days and one for their new Hebrew name and new friends from seminary usually this profile has only tznius pictures and no guy friends. I do love it however, when you look at their new profile and you can tell they started becoming normal again because they are showing their elbows and friends with guys albeit nice Jewish guys that they met on shabbos.

I have heard of girls burning their untznius clothing, almost all of them regret it afterward, when they realize that tank tops can be worn over long sleeved shirts and pants can be worn depending on your observance level. Of course for all those ex-sluts those mini skirts and thigh high hooker boots may be a problem.

What is it with BT girls and Blue Fringe?

BT girls who come back from Israel took about how beautiful everything is. If they could I am sure all BT girls would kiss their hands after they shook yours.

I find that the girls that BT programs dont want are the types that read this blog, questioning cynics are bad for business.

Now do you understand why I dont write about BT girlsI have nothing to say! But I want to hear your thoughts and if you want to write a guest post about your experiences or thoughts please send it down.

{ 80 comments… add one }
  • Frayda July 13, 2009, 10:06 AM

    Good post!

    • Steve April 19, 2012, 1:51 PM

      So you support mocking people who are looking for meaning in their lives ?

  • mensch July 13, 2009, 11:12 AM

    1) challah baking is also a big kiruv marketing tactic
    2) love to babysit rabbi’s kids on shabbos
    3) “air hug” becomes thing to do besides lighting candles 5 hours before shabbos
    4) after eating rebetzin’s food for first time on shabbos, suddenly realize they can’t cook close to a tenth as good. they start feeling worthless and get guilted into start wondering “what kind of girl am I?”
    5) meets the rabbi’s daughter and suddenly feels…

  • Bsamim Smoker July 13, 2009, 11:22 AM

    Washes hands(or any other body part)that comes in contact with the male gender

  • Cee July 13, 2009, 11:33 AM

    Chabad single guys do not light shabbos candles. A mother lights keeping her sons in mind whereever they are.

    • y January 5, 2011, 7:52 PM

      incorrect. if women (mother/wife) not around man obligated to light. Halacha. chabad or not.

  • Frum Satire July 13, 2009, 11:41 AM

    I’m expecting a compliment on how cool of a picture I got to illustrate the post

    • phineas February 26, 2011, 11:47 PM

      the picture was awsome!!!!

  • Mohita July 13, 2009, 11:43 AM

    Cee,
    Chabad single guys DO light Shabbos candles, its not a minhag rather a halacha.

    Just to clarify, its ONLY when you are alone that you light, if you are a single guy. Most single guys are either in yeshiva or eating with a family, hence your misconfusion, but if you were a single guy eating all alone in your apt (or a bochur or 2 alone on mercas shlichus in the summer), its a halacha that you do have to light.

  • ShomerTHIS July 13, 2009, 11:45 AM

    “Shomer Negiah-Its like Communism (with a capital C), The theory looks really good on paper, but in reality it wouldn’t work ”
    -Aaron Meller (Sir Aaron of Merion)

    • y January 5, 2011, 7:54 PM

      what are you talking about? random irrelevant quote

    • jew March 24, 2013, 9:32 PM

      you say “wouldn’t” probably because you’ve never tried it.

  • Susanne July 13, 2009, 12:08 PM

    I’ll be the one to say that some BT girls can turn out perfectly normal. When I became frum at 18, I only hung out with frummy girls and pictured myself one day never wearing pants, wearing a sheital (with a husband in a black hat), and never eating in my parent’s house again. But I’ve found myself today 10 yrs later settled comfortably as a Modern Orthodox Liberal Jew. I wear jeans, my husband wears a srugy, and I still find a way to eat at my parents. Orthodoxy for a BT is what they make of it. Theres no absolute right way to do it. You can go all the way to the right, or you can end up where I am. Just keep it real.

  • Puzzled July 13, 2009, 12:14 PM

    They say everything is amazing and exclaim “that’s so good” at the smallest piece of news – good or bad. They constantly ask you to sing because they want to. They call women sluts and shiksas for wearing anything tight or revealing. They go to extremes because someone told them they can only learn practical halacha, so have no clue how it fits together or what the actual sources say.

  • He Who Fights Monsters July 13, 2009, 12:20 PM

    I have seen the air hug, and it is disgusting.

    Now, someone should have a list of things to do in order of level of observance. That is to say, we need a mitzvah manual organized not according to the Tur or the Mishnah or the Mishneh Torah or the Shulchan Aruch…

    We need a mitzvah manual organized by how shtark it makes you, from less shtark to more shtark.

  • Frum Satire July 13, 2009, 12:24 PM

    He who fights – I’ll start – Doing mayim achronim in the weekdays makes you look like a moron.

    Only NCSY people do the shomer negiah hi five.

    • Anonymous February 9, 2011, 7:42 AM

      and the “Shomer hug”

    • Anonymous June 17, 2012, 2:22 AM

      Mayim Achronim is a halacha no matter what day of the year

  • OrthoEbonyJewessNJ July 13, 2009, 12:35 PM

    These girls have to start some where. It doesn’t matter where they start (i.e. shomerette negia) it’s where they end up… Yiddishkeit.

  • mensch July 13, 2009, 12:40 PM

    the “air hug” and “air five” are still popular in college kiruv circles

  • Mat July 13, 2009, 1:06 PM

    The face-in-siddur/bentcher seudas shlishis shuckle is super crucial.

    Why do they think that singing lev tahor really intensely will get them a shidduch?

  • KosherBride July 13, 2009, 2:08 PM

    Let’s face it. Overenthusiastic behavior towards singing is not just a BT phenomenon. In your run of the mill Bais Yaakov when there is a free period because someone could not find a substitute teacher there will always be a few girls who decide they should spend this time by singing. It’s abnormal and creepy but singing seems to be the way to identify yourself as a good maidel who deserves a great shidduch.

    Possibly reason for how the singing phenomenon started: The Bais yaakovs like to use a lot of the kiruv tactics on their girls. After all can’t everyone do teshuvah and get loser to hashem no matter how frum they are right now? “If you’re not moving forward you’re moving backward”.

    • Dave September 19, 2010, 10:09 AM

      guys do plenty of singing too
      I went to chofetz chaim in brooklyn for high school and we sang plenty. and chofetz chaim is litvish, one of the least sing-song branches in ashkenaz jewry. Song is a big part of religious jewish life. Dancing in a circle too.

    • BTgirl (Not Crazy) November 3, 2013, 5:09 PM

      Just tossing this out there… some of us sing in our free time because that was what we did before we became religious and it’s just something we like to do.

  • Anonymous July 13, 2009, 2:57 PM

    Mohita…

    It’s not a Halocho that males have to light if they are alone on the condition that someone from their house (usually their mother) has them in mind while she is lighting hers. Yes, males can light if they live alone, but their are not required to make a brocho.

  • anon July 13, 2009, 3:00 PM

    it looks like you borrowed from larry flint and hooters in creating you BT girls picture, if in fact you are the original creator.

  • elky July 13, 2009, 3:02 PM

    frum satire-====–===—===–===—====messed up bloggitis

  • Frum Satire July 13, 2009, 3:22 PM

    Anon – I have no idea how to create pictures. All of the images I use are from Google Images – if you were to google “BT girls” that’s the number 1 picture

  • Anonymous July 13, 2009, 3:22 PM

    For BT Girls on Facebook, the best way you can tell is by looking at photos of her, but instead of looking from the most recent to earliest, go backwards (ex/ 400 of 400 all the way to 1 of 400)

    that way you can see the transition to becoming frum

  • ShomerTHIS July 13, 2009, 4:52 PM

    According to the talmud shomer negiah is permitted ( as seen with the Rabbi who would put the Kallah on his shoulders at weddings)

    According to the Chumrah Institute of Chumrah Technology YOU WILL ALL GO TO GEHINOM FOR TOUCHING ANY FEMALES!

    I was once on a bus in Bnei Barak and I saw that the Chareidi bus driver had gloves on, and he told one of the passengers that the gloves we so he didnt have to hand any change to women.

    Personally who ever comes up with all these tzenius/negiah/yichud/nedah chumrahs should get his/her head out of the gutter and try to promote ahavas yisrael instead of stupid new chumras to make people in feel new ways to live in their bubbles (Kiryat Sefer/Bnei Barak/Meah Shearim)

    • Dan May 15, 2011, 2:06 PM

      Oh this is good.
      Perhaps you didn’t see the next three words of the gemara you quote about the rabbi with the bride on his shoulders: “v’ein halacha kmoso” “and the law is not like this opinion”.

  • ghottistyx July 13, 2009, 10:05 PM

    Re: BT girls and Blue Fringe.

    Probably “Flippin’ Out”, even if the song does begin with a tongue-in-cheek mockery of sem. girls on Friday morning walking thru Ben Yehuda, oh the gashmius.

    If I had a dollar for every BT who considers “Flippin’ Out” a good thing… I’ve discussed it with the band members myself (all of whom are old friends of mine), and we all agree that Flippin’ Out is poking fun of those who go to Israel, “flip out”, and usually “land the plane” (as my rosh yeshiva would have said) within the next year back. There’s actually an old comic: the first strip is “typical Jewish teenager before Israel”, he’s wearing baggy pants, chains, has scruffy hair, headphones, is smoking a cigarette, the works. The second strip is “same guy, right after Israel”. Now he’s got a button down shirt tucked in, tzitzit hanging out, clean haircut, carrying a sefer, et al. The third strip is “same guy one year later”; it’s the same as the first picture.

    I’ve heard Dov, the lead singer of Blue Fringe, discussing the real message of the song. As he says, there’s “flippin’ out” and “flippin in”. Flippin’ out is the bad kind, where you walk the walk, talk the talk, but are still the same old asshole underneath it all; having spent 2 years in Gush, Dov saw his share of it. Flippin’ in, though, is the kind where one really internalizes what they got out of Israel. That’s another torah altogether.

  • Yochanan July 13, 2009, 11:49 PM

    anon #17:

    BT girls ( I looked it up) is a Native American / First Nations modeling agency. It may not be complying with the rules of tzni’ut, but certainly isn’t Hustler.

  • To ShomerTHIS - July 14, 2009, 10:52 AM

    Whoa, You’re totally off!
    @ShomerTHIS –

    If you’d read that piece in Talmud (Kesubos 17) – it immediately explains:
    B/c holding the kallah was as a “beam” (i.e., an entirely un-sensual experience) for THIS PARTICULAR Amora, as per his high level of piety and sanctity – and thus did it only for the Mitzvah of “l’sameach chasan v’kallah”.

  • Anonymous Girl July 14, 2009, 1:19 PM

    While I agree with much of this post, I deleted a lot of my untznius photos from facebook simply because they reminded me of my ex.

    I surprisingly didn`t have to throw out much clothing beyond pants because I treasured my tops too much.

    Also never listened to Blue Fringe, and only heard of them from reading this blog.

    And people always tell me the only time I really look relidge is on Shabbos but the rest of the week go for the hippie look, but that also counts for the fact that I do a lot of camping and go to music festivals.

    While working at the clothing show I found the most awesome tznius skirts by this local designer who imports organic fair trade cotton from Nepal and creates very earth tone fairy-like designs. And a lot of them are so durable and perfect for a four day adventure in the wilderness.

    I came back from Israel pissing and moaning how cold and stinky it is here.

  • Puzzled July 14, 2009, 1:30 PM

    Doesn’t the Talmud say in many places that no one is above a sexual sin – i.e. that there is no one particular person to whom an act that would otherwise be sexual is not? If that is so, then this action must have been permitted to everyone, not just to him.

    If not, then I’ll say that I, unlike apparently some people, am capable of shaking hands and being alone without having sex. Therefore, for me in particular, these things shouldn’t be forbidden, right?

  • BT girl July 14, 2009, 5:39 PM

    As a BT girl myself, I always laugh at the girls who go extreme and think that everything is amazingly beautiful and awesome. But then again, that kind of thinking usually fades after a month or so back home amongst real people.

    I think that phase lasted about 1 day for me. But yea not all BT girls go crazy burning all of their old stuff. I’ve kept most of my old clothes, esp the mini skirts – when I’m bored at home I try them on to get a kick out of the fact that I used to think that 3 inches of denim constitutes a “skirt”.

  • Anonymous Girl July 15, 2009, 10:31 AM

    BT girl,

    Earlier this year I was still working as a door girl at this club Sunday nights and I relished the ability to wear my inappropriate t-shirts like “NEW YORK FUCKIN CITY” knowing full well nobody from the community would see.

    But then G-d forbid anyone ever saw my elbows or knees.

  • Annie July 21, 2009, 9:06 PM

    I feel incredibly offended by this article. Being a BT is a constant struggle and I often don’t feel welcome in observant communities. This article is representative of the unnecessary negative treatment towards BT.

    I wish people would think twice before making fun and put attention into how they can better welcome a BT into their community.

    • Anonymous February 17, 2010, 9:49 PM

      I am also a BT and I am also really upset about this article. People who judge others unfairly, insult other people, or act badly toward them are religious on the outside but not truly on the inside. You made the choice to become religious and you should be appreciated for that. Anyway, being religious is between you and Hashem an it doesn’t matter what anyone says or thinks. You should try the Chabad communities, they are very welcoming and more accepting. Good luck!

    • Mika February 10, 2013, 10:32 PM

      Honestly, I am quite offended by this article. It might be funny to those on the outside, but to someone who is constantly facing the challenges that come along with being a teenage baal teshuva, this article is quite offensive. It’s extremely important to keep Shabbos, kashrus, shomer negiah, tznius, and etc, but it’s also extremely important to live your life by the way of ahavas yisrael-loving your fellow Jew. I don’t think that I would be where I am today if it weren’t for the love and support I received from a nearby Jewish community. Slander and lashon hara is what got our holy beis hamikdash destroyed, and speaking so rudely about BTs isn’t any better.
      Annie, I’d love for you to email me. 🙂
      xxblazingfire@gmail.com

      • Lisa March 29, 2013, 10:53 AM

        Personally, as a proud Jew with enormous respect for any Jew observing his or her faith with true righteousness, I found it in poor taste. I would also like to add that it may not only hurt and turn away a Baal Teshuvah, but it may also offend one who has been raised very observant from birth, as the feel of the article suggests that it is implying all Orthodox Jews make these jokes and speak loshan hora.

  • Ben zmani July 25, 2009, 2:35 AM

    I find BT girls’ prime motivator in becoming frum to be their mothering instinct. They yearn to be part of a close-knit, Beaver Cleaver type family ensconced within a warm communal fabric. This is precisely what they experience on Shabbos, their primary exposure to frumkeit early on.

    Blogger, this explains why the undertaking of SN commonly precedes actual halakhic observance. It’s the clearest way to break from a past of ‘dating around’ to ‘developing a family.’

    Does this diminish their commitment for the actual Word? The nuts and bolts? Maybe. That’s why platitudes like ‘amazing, beautiful, awesome, and Hasheeeeeemmmmm!’ must be put forward; and also why these notions are often short-lived.

    I dig BT girls and their perspectives so I’ve dated quite a few and this is just my read on the ones I’ve known.

  • S. July 26, 2009, 1:53 AM

    Or that they know only that “Girls dont learn” and expect that to be enough to fulfill their knowledge of halachos, because they were told in Israel.

  • R.H. May 19, 2010, 10:10 PM

    as an FFB i have utmost respect for BTs. everyone makes mistakes, but their hearts are in the right place. we can’t imagine what it would be like to grow up secular. BTs have enough courage, insight and clarity to leave the secular world behind for yiddishkeit. r’ akiba, of course, was a BT. for that matter, you could argue that avraham avinu was a BT. heard a shiur to taht effect.

    i would hope this post hasn’t made any BT readers ashamed or discouraged. you guys are amazing (yes, i use that word!)

    • Lisa March 29, 2013, 11:00 AM

      This comment made me so unbelievably happy and honestly, relieved. As a female college student rediscovering my Judaism, I found this article and the comments very offensive and discouraging, because yes, I want to continue to become more observant, but I do not want to be a part of a community where I will be made fun of behind my back. I hope that those who share the same feelings as the author of the article will one day realize the significance of concepts like tinok shenishba and loshan hora, and will be more sensitive to others.

  • Ben September 7, 2010, 6:19 PM

    I can’t agree with much of anything you say, but my what a talented writer you are. Had I been born to Jews and never pursued a career in science I would read your blog all the time.

    Even though I’ll probably never stumble onto this blog again; nice work.

  • Heather September 20, 2010, 7:54 AM

    BT girls stop drinking alcohol at meals with FFBs because it is not tznius to like alcohol (really, this is what you are told at BT school)

    BT girls are so eager to get married so they are accepted by the community that many marry cast-offs from the FFB niche

    Some become extremely irritating by telling you every gedol’s halacha interpretation and they expect you to listen to them

    If you and friend went to the same seminary and use to discuss everything but now she is too frum to talk about movies, tv shows or sex.

    She uses terms like chas’vshalom, chas vchalila, B”H, oy vey ismer and stam in every conversation

    She is all embarassed to tell a shachan she can’t marry a kohein

    They all put on a massive amount of weight in the beginning because they stopped exercising and eating right and instead eat greasy slop (aka chollent) kishka, kugel (or keegal or koogel, depending who frumerized them) plus dessert and the only exercise they get is walking to shul sat morning

  • anon October 27, 2010, 1:16 PM

    As a convert I find this conversation on BT girls depressing. Why do you have to be so negative toward your fellow Jew? Don’t you know how you judge your fellow Jew is how you will be judged, mida keneged mida? I find no humor in your ‘making fun of’ — your cynicism towards those struggling to find their way back to Hashem. Maybe a little introspection will do you good and rid you of your arrogance. Then instead of criticizing Jews and making fun of them you can really be funny instead of cruel. This advice goes to most of your so, so sophisticated reader’s (female) who weren’t satisfied with your destruction of the character of BT girls and felt they needed to add their scathing commentary. This truly was a session of scorners…

    • its complicated September 23, 2012, 10:41 AM

      Uh, ok anon, I respect your hurt and frustration and clear pain. As the daughter of one Jewish parent (wrong parent) who is converting to Judaism but prefers for the sense of over-simplification to self-consider a BT, I find this conversation hilarious. I laughed with joy and delight. This post is satire. Do you understand what satire is? It is intentionally meant to ridicule, exaggerrate, and criticize for humoristic aims. And indeed, I find it HILARIOUS! These are all stereotypes, but well, they are all true! The writer doesn’t actually hate BTs, he’s simply poking fun at the awkward transition, or whatever it is. And I mean, it IS awkward.

      The way I see it, (because remember, I’m a halfling half-breed and not really a real Jew until I dip myself in some spiritual mikveh waters collected from fresh rain or something like that), is that whenever I get offended by something ‘mean’ some mean frum person says about me, I realize that the part of me that is getting defensive is my goyish tendency, which every day I further strive to overcome. There is always room to grow in one’s Judaism and to strengthen one’s connection to Hashem. If you feel hurt by something, realize where that pain is coming from, and then work to improve those areas and grow stronger from it.

      This is only life. Don’t take it too seriously. Hashem wants you to be happy, and if you really, truly, with pure emuna trusted in Him, you would have no reason to feel insecure.

      • its complicated September 23, 2012, 10:51 AM

        and yes, I’m ‘bumping’ a two year old post, because I think it carries relevance into today for the present-day readers.

  • Kochavim February 10, 2011, 9:06 AM

    Hesh- I love your blogs and find you hysterical. But I didn’t understand this article.
    I’d consider myself a “BTITW” (Baal Teshuva in the working, and i KNOW you like your acronyms). I love orthodoxy because it just makes perfect sense and completes the harmony in my life that I have sought. I love the chabad, where I learn, and Aish, where I learn. I love the beauty of the Shabbos candles because me and my brother used to try and put them out with our fingers as young children. I want to be respected by my male counterparts… I might be the exact BT you thought of when you wrote this!
    But in the end… you act like that is all to speak about! I find that the funniest things are the BTs! I daven like a male, was confused at that awkward “omg-you-have-HOW-many-kids?!” conversation, and going to a shabbos and asking the rabbi what chulent was! The hardest thing about becoming orthodox is wearing a skirt! You like satire, eh?, ask a BT about all those incidences when she pulls a faux pas!

    • its complicated September 23, 2012, 10:46 AM

      you are my hero

  • anon March 13, 2011, 12:56 PM

    sending encouragement for all the BT girls..hashem loves you!

  • D May 15, 2011, 6:52 PM

    This is incredible. Coming from college circles, I know exactly what this is all about, and it really hits the nail on the head. Keep it up!

  • Moshe May 17, 2011, 3:23 PM

    BS”D
    Never saw this blog,but have read about 9 posts.All were funny.Being in Chabad these last 35 years & a BT I’ve found much of this post strange to me.Lubavitch doesn’t just teach Practicle Halacha for BT women,they do learn quite a lot of Chabad Chassidut,Chumash,Nevi’m.As far as acceptance,so many Lubavitchers were formerly not Frum.A Jew is a Jew including Gerie Tzedek of any colour.IF a BT woman puts on weight its for 2 reasons: she doesn’t go to the athletics classes or she realized that before being Frum she was intentionally vomitting,starving to please some faggot French Designer’s idea of “Real Women”.

  • Anna May 30, 2011, 11:14 AM

    heshy you hit the nail on the head regarding bts. I was brought up traditional and I’m now modern orthodox, and I do find bts hilarious. They do all the things you said and are uber nice to everybody (lest lashon hara) . That said, I have to hand it to them, well done on going from nothing to everything. I just don’t like the fact that it often involves being charedi, wearing a hat/tights and doing other inane things that are way beyond the call of halachah.

  • Moshe May 30, 2011, 2:47 PM

    BS”D
    My Father OB”M wasn’t Frum but a fiery Jew in all things.Nor I until 25, 33 years agoHe once told me “Notice that most jokes have someone as the Shlemiel being laughed at,it could be a racial slur,ethnic,religious,national,etc” Someone “suffers” the joke. My Father had one of the most attractive human personalities in our small town yet his many jokes found a common humour to all people where we all laugh together.
    I”ve been a great fan of “Monty Python’s Flying Circus” for 45 years, some of the greatest modern satire. There people can see how imperfect all of us are as humans or just chuck it and laugh at everyone.
    The more I read here I’m seeing a pattern of “I am above all this and so I laugh at these puny Yidden in their various forms”. Its not Zniut,its not humble.
    A Jew should realize that we all share the same basic form and identity, we look to see what we all have in common.A Jew who looks for tiny barely seen lint on a person’s coat is diving One People. That person feels better in trying to pidgeon-hole each Yid,which group,of what age,sex (or not so often), is that frum group out of the Jewish Frum world’s concensus?
    We were Created inperfect by a Perfect One Infinate G-D so we will search for our “other half” and become one. A 14 year old can do this without getting married, or 2 women neighbors, 2 men from the same Shul. If we look for the type of hat,round,brim up,down with barely a pinch, or a gouge in the front. Or not hat, Kippa,type or none,what is this to you?
    Unless you are paying his rent, cooking his food and paying him at work.
    Here we are in the days of Sfira,nu. I myself have the same problem. The flame might flare up for a moment as I judge but then like a you do to a putz,you give it a wack and it shrivels to its puny size.
    The attempt has to be made.I’ a putz,but I certainly don’t want to be more of a shmuck than I already am.

  • rey November 27, 2011, 1:49 AM

    “…and pants can be worn depending on your observance level.”

    What the hell does that mean?

    • Person December 1, 2011, 10:29 PM

      Yeah I pretty much did a *blank head tilt* at that remark.

  • woman March 13, 2012, 8:17 PM

    Don’t you have anything better to do with your time than tear other people apart? You are not lifting anyone up with your words or being funny. You are just being cruel to people. Maybe you are jealous because they found something and you are still searching. Someone needs to go back and study Hillel again.

    • Dan March 13, 2012, 8:33 PM

      You just bumped a 3 year old post to say that.

  • Steve April 19, 2012, 1:50 PM

    You are mocking people who go through a difficult process in order to find meaning and community in their lives that is entirely missing in the secular world. I cannot respect that.

    If you wish to run head long into meaninglessness, and trade in community for rugged brute individualism, then go for it, but if you wish to be respected then you need to respect others.

  • Alter Cocker April 19, 2012, 2:10 PM

    why would babysitting at the local chabad make you want to become frum? because it gives the chabad rabbi a chance to work his magic?

  • Nicky September 27, 2012, 2:12 PM

    This is ‘amaaaaazing’

    Marry me?

  • Laura September 27, 2012, 10:29 PM

    “(I mean the kiruv folks kind of advertise candle lighting as this beautiful womans mitzvah and all)”

    ugh…I’m not a woman, btw, cause lighting the candles is NOT my favorite mitzvah i mean geez

  • Gabrielle October 10, 2012, 9:50 PM

    I am a BT girl and it was through out all my life when i was little i would always ask to light candles or not mix meat and milk even though my family did. It wasnt until i got to college when they had kosher meal plans that i was able to keep strict kosher and then the campus chabad enabled me to keep shabbos and be in an amazing enviorment. So not all BT girls are like that! And I also come from a strong study background and am very proud of it and I plan to leave to go study more in israel next year. So out with the negative and in with the positive. But i do agree with you, no one should go shomer negiah first….it is difficult and makes no sense at first and is the wrong reasons to become more observant. Anyways I just thought Id share a little bit! Lila Tov!

  • Becca December 9, 2012, 9:27 AM

    I went to Neve Yerushalayim for six months and was exposed to the BT lifestyle, and was one myself…perhaps I still am, though I am not observant. I just have to say that I recognize this is a satirical website…but I don’t understand how you can call yourself a frum, “observant” Jew and still speak about women the way you do in this piece. Being happy about “hot girls” coming into the fray? Calling BT girls ex-sluts? A tremendous amount of pain and careful consideration goes into a woman’s process in becoming frum, and to have you not only trivialize it but objectify the women who are engaged in it is shameful and incredibly upsetting. I only hope no one ever thought of me this way while I was in Jerusalem. There’s a difference between poking good-natured fun at BT girls, and absolutely reducing them to simplified, either sexualized or asexualized “ex-sluts.” Honestly.

    • oldpostsarefun February 9, 2013, 8:17 PM

      Neve doesn’t like to talk about the MO crowd and variations within which include people who text on shabbos and still consider themselves Frum. Ie. Frum isn’t a synonym of observant. Funny how people who consider themselves so liberal and “with it” would call any woman a “slut”. However I like to think perhaps Heshy puts on a good show for blog purposes and means well even if I don’t agree with it.

      *Bumping for OTD-BT who made the best anti-post comment (sadly 3 years late).

    • Masha Chava December 16, 2013, 4:32 PM

      But technically I was an ex-slut.

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  • Masha Chava December 16, 2013, 4:29 PM

    You bet I schukel when i daven. There is nothing in halacha that says I cant. I dont give a ….. about your minhags, Its waay better then how those freaky “FFB” women just stand there lifeless swaying while “moving their lips with out making a sound” like a dead ghost. AND I probably WILL get a better shidduch because of how awesome I am. WAIT IN LINE.

  • Barakas August 25, 2014, 2:44 PM

    I once dated this girl in college who became BT. It’s like she went from attractive to blahh. Long denim skirts with sneakers is not attractive. I swear some of these attractive BT girls who were once fashionable now dress like they just arrived at Ellis Island in 1920. And when she got back from Israel, touching was out of the question. I remember putting on a glove one time and asked if I could shake her hand. Challah baking is a great kiruv marketing tactic as one commenter mentioned. To get a non-frum Jewish woman in the kitchen is like splitting the Yam Soof. Even modern ortho women are becoming lazy in the kitchen as well. Thank God for this challah baking because it exposes them to cooking instead of ordering Chinese. Attractive FFB women who are modern know how to play the tzsnius card well by wearing tight clothes with high heels and know how to expose that collar bone cleavage. My imagination runs wild trying to figure out what’s under there. I went to a Jewish day school during my elementary years and then switched to public school. Thank God you orthos have some sort of modesty dress code in your schools because imagine being a 13 year old boy in a public school gym class. Imagine doing stretches and the girl in front of you is wearing short shorts with her tuchus sticking in your face. Your schmekel has a mind of its own. No wonder I was so damn distracted throughout all my academic life. The problem with these BT girls is that they take on too much and then it comes crashing down on them when they realize how hard it is to be frum and then regret dumping their black boyfriend who they dated just to piss off daddy. Baby steps people.

  • elizabeth lee April 28, 2016, 9:06 AM

    Question: Are you an FFB or are you a BT? I’m thinking you couldn’t possibly be a FFB. Oh, I get it. Your an FFB in front of family and friends but really a closet “off the derech” bitter young women. This article is telling me that you are harboring inner self-esteem issues. Am I right? As a BT myself, you would think that I am offended. Wrong.. Its so sad how much you have lost in your life by having to write these articles. Surely you must have a better, worthy purpose in life than mocking BT’s. After all, Hashem handed you yiddishkeit from the time you were born, on a silver platter. Unlike myself who truly had to work for it. But its okay because I know my place and as rightous and well versed as you probably are from your seminary education you must know this selection in Rambam’s Laws of Teshuva “Makom shebaalei Teshuva Omdim ein Tzadikim Gemurim Yecholim Laamod Bo. In the place where a Baal Teshuva, a returnee to Judaism, stands, a completely righteous person cannot stand.” So go ahead, continue mocking us. And when Rosh Hashanah comes around you can think about all the BT’s you could have made a positive impact on.

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