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	<title>Comments on: Rebel Ashkenazim begin to eat Kitniyot on&#160;pesach</title>
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	<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/</link>
	<description>It aint always frum and it aint always satire</description>
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		<title>By: MemoryMine</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-68067</link>
		<dc:creator>MemoryMine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 13:01:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-68067</guid>
		<description>In the 60&#039;s and 70&#039;s it was common, during Pesach, for ashkenazi dati people in Israel to eat &quot;derivatives of kitniyot&quot;...those items from the stores, like, if I remember correctly, margarine, that weren&#039;t the bean or corn itself, but had ingredients made from the kitniyot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the 60&#8217;s and 70&#8217;s it was common, during Pesach, for ashkenazi dati people in Israel to eat &#8220;derivatives of kitniyot&#8221;&#8230;those items from the stores, like, if I remember correctly, margarine, that weren&#8217;t the bean or corn itself, but had ingredients made from the kitniyot.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67975</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Apr 2009 02:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67975</guid>
		<description>Puzzled,
Were not blaming any victim, were just stuck with what&#039;s been built upon. We see that Rashi forbids eating grasshoppers because we aren&#039;t sure any more, even though the Torah clearly allows locusts, crickets and grasshoppers. Same goes for most birds. The Torah only forbids about 25 species, but only eat about 10 species. What happened to all the tasty species in between such as flamingos, parrots and penguins?

Double M,
Only way I heard of is for people that once ate it and then stopped. They have the option of being matir neder and revert. So if a sefardi became a lubab, he can revert to sephardi customs and get rid of the chumras. Would like to know more about the Cacham Ovadiah ruling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Puzzled,<br />
Were not blaming any victim, were just stuck with what&#8217;s been built upon. We see that Rashi forbids eating grasshoppers because we aren&#8217;t sure any more, even though the Torah clearly allows locusts, crickets and grasshoppers. Same goes for most birds. The Torah only forbids about 25 species, but only eat about 10 species. What happened to all the tasty species in between such as flamingos, parrots and penguins?</p>
<p>Double M,<br />
Only way I heard of is for people that once ate it and then stopped. They have the option of being matir neder and revert. So if a sefardi became a lubab, he can revert to sephardi customs and get rid of the chumras. Would like to know more about the Cacham Ovadiah ruling.</p>
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		<title>By: Double M</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67940</link>
		<dc:creator>Double M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Apr 2009 06:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67940</guid>
		<description>If you want I think that chacham Ovidah said there is a way for those who do not eat kitniyot to shed themselves of that custom.  Consult your local orthodox rabbi… that follows chcahm Ovidah for the details.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you want I think that chacham Ovidah said there is a way for those who do not eat kitniyot to shed themselves of that custom.  Consult your local orthodox rabbi… that follows chcahm Ovidah for the details.</p>
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		<title>By: Puzzled</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67933</link>
		<dc:creator>Puzzled</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Apr 2009 03:04:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67933</guid>
		<description>So, we say that once a custom is accepted by the nation, we can&#039;t eliminate it, even if all the reasons are gone.  Isn&#039;t this a more sophisticated version of blaming the victim?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, we say that once a custom is accepted by the nation, we can&#8217;t eliminate it, even if all the reasons are gone.  Isn&#8217;t this a more sophisticated version of blaming the victim?</p>
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		<title>By: Great post about Ashkenazim going against Kitniyos&#8230;essentially &#8216;why do we have these chumras&#8217; &#171; Married and Navigating Jewish Life</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67910</link>
		<dc:creator>Great post about Ashkenazim going against Kitniyos&#8230;essentially &#8216;why do we have these chumras&#8217; &#171; Married and Navigating Jewish Life</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 11:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67910</guid>
		<description>[...] a comment &#187;  Frum Satire has this great article with a few commenters bringing in links to show that people where this has [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a comment &raquo;  Frum Satire has this great article with a few commenters bringing in links to show that people where this has [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67898</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 03:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67898</guid>
		<description>I went through these issues and related chumros with a very knowladgeable Rabbi over Yom tov.

Though most of the restrictions are based on facts that are non existent today, once they became common minhagim, getting rid of them is virtually impossible.

Strangely enough, potatoes weren&#039;t allowed in Vilna during the times preceding the Vilna Gaon, apparently they found a heter one year due to a hunger.

Also interesting to note, is that both kitniyot and gebroks both came from the same German rabbi, namely the &quot;smak&quot; that lived about 700 years ago. Other Ashkenazic authorities later concurred.

Another interesting thing about minhag hamakom, is that America&#039;s first Jews were sefardim escaping the inquisition. The first known American shul was in Rhode Island, apparently built with an escape tunnel under the shtender. Looks like the Ashkenazis &quot;hijacked&quot; the continent in halachic terms. Accordingly, we should really be eating rice and lamb for the seder. Hopefully next year in Jerusalem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I went through these issues and related chumros with a very knowladgeable Rabbi over Yom tov.</p>
<p>Though most of the restrictions are based on facts that are non existent today, once they became common minhagim, getting rid of them is virtually impossible.</p>
<p>Strangely enough, potatoes weren&#8217;t allowed in Vilna during the times preceding the Vilna Gaon, apparently they found a heter one year due to a hunger.</p>
<p>Also interesting to note, is that both kitniyot and gebroks both came from the same German rabbi, namely the &#8220;smak&#8221; that lived about 700 years ago. Other Ashkenazic authorities later concurred.</p>
<p>Another interesting thing about minhag hamakom, is that America&#8217;s first Jews were sefardim escaping the inquisition. The first known American shul was in Rhode Island, apparently built with an escape tunnel under the shtender. Looks like the Ashkenazis &#8220;hijacked&#8221; the continent in halachic terms. Accordingly, we should really be eating rice and lamb for the seder. Hopefully next year in Jerusalem.</p>
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		<title>By: MO and proud of it</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67893</link>
		<dc:creator>MO and proud of it</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Apr 2009 21:22:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67893</guid>
		<description>There is a halacha that when you move to a new community, you take on the minhagim of that community.  If the ashkenazim who first came from Europe to Eretz Yisrael had done that, we wouldn&#039;t have this problem.  (The Ashkenazim who are rebelling, as far as I am aware, are doing so on this basis -- that we are now Eretz Yisrael Jews and that in Eretz Yisrael the prevailing minhag is to eat kitniyot.)  The issue is that now, Eretz Yisrael really is a place with two competing sets of minhagim.  But it never should have happened.

The people who are doing this, though, are also rebelling against the increasing stringencies (and idiocies, IMHO) regarding the whole practice of avoiding kitniyot.  It is a gezerah and so by its terms we are not supposed to add to it - once again, that&#039;s halacha.  A generation ago, everyone ate peanuts on Pesach.  Now, it is accepted that they are kitniyot.  Cottonseed oil has just joined the list.  Quinoa is in dispute.  How can quinoa be kitniyot?  Nobody ate it until 15 years ago, how can we have a tradition not to eat it?  Also, it&#039;s a fruit, not a grain.  But it looks kinda like kitniyot, and it tastes kinda like kitniyot, and so TPTB have decided that it is.  And even if you don&#039;t agree, good luck finding KFP quinoa now.  One rabbi this year called on people not to eat tomatoes, cucumbers and eggplants because they have seeds.  

So people are fed up.  I predict that within a generation, MOs in Israel will be eating kitniyot.  The haredim won&#039;t do it, of course.  And chutz la&#039;aretz is another issue, because the Israelis won&#039;t call it rebellion against the rabbis, we&#039;ll call it joining in the prevailing minhag of our new home (which it is).  But it wouldn&#039;t have happened if the (haredi) rabbinate hadn&#039;t gone crazy to the point that Pesach is more about avoiding kitniyot than it is about avoiding hametz.  Will the rabbis learn from this?  Interesting question.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a halacha that when you move to a new community, you take on the minhagim of that community.  If the ashkenazim who first came from Europe to Eretz Yisrael had done that, we wouldn&#8217;t have this problem.  (The Ashkenazim who are rebelling, as far as I am aware, are doing so on this basis &#8212; that we are now Eretz Yisrael Jews and that in Eretz Yisrael the prevailing minhag is to eat kitniyot.)  The issue is that now, Eretz Yisrael really is a place with two competing sets of minhagim.  But it never should have happened.</p>
<p>The people who are doing this, though, are also rebelling against the increasing stringencies (and idiocies, IMHO) regarding the whole practice of avoiding kitniyot.  It is a gezerah and so by its terms we are not supposed to add to it &#8211; once again, that&#8217;s halacha.  A generation ago, everyone ate peanuts on Pesach.  Now, it is accepted that they are kitniyot.  Cottonseed oil has just joined the list.  Quinoa is in dispute.  How can quinoa be kitniyot?  Nobody ate it until 15 years ago, how can we have a tradition not to eat it?  Also, it&#8217;s a fruit, not a grain.  But it looks kinda like kitniyot, and it tastes kinda like kitniyot, and so TPTB have decided that it is.  And even if you don&#8217;t agree, good luck finding KFP quinoa now.  One rabbi this year called on people not to eat tomatoes, cucumbers and eggplants because they have seeds.  </p>
<p>So people are fed up.  I predict that within a generation, MOs in Israel will be eating kitniyot.  The haredim won&#8217;t do it, of course.  And chutz la&#8217;aretz is another issue, because the Israelis won&#8217;t call it rebellion against the rabbis, we&#8217;ll call it joining in the prevailing minhag of our new home (which it is).  But it wouldn&#8217;t have happened if the (haredi) rabbinate hadn&#8217;t gone crazy to the point that Pesach is more about avoiding kitniyot than it is about avoiding hametz.  Will the rabbis learn from this?  Interesting question.</p>
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		<title>By: Chavi</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67853</link>
		<dc:creator>Chavi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Apr 2009 05:17:01 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I want in, too. I&#039;d rock Sephardic traditions being a convert and all, but since the dude I&#039;m with (what a champ he is) is Ashkenazic and that means I follow his traditions anyway. 

I think the stickler for those who are anti-kitniyot ban is that you&#039;re not supposed to &quot;turn away from the traditions of your fathers,&quot; and that&#039;s the big crux of the whole thing. It&#039;s been done so long, as tradition -- whether halakic or not -- and the rabbis are sticklers for tradition. 

TRADITION!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want in, too. I&#8217;d rock Sephardic traditions being a convert and all, but since the dude I&#8217;m with (what a champ he is) is Ashkenazic and that means I follow his traditions anyway. </p>
<p>I think the stickler for those who are anti-kitniyot ban is that you&#8217;re not supposed to &#8220;turn away from the traditions of your fathers,&#8221; and that&#8217;s the big crux of the whole thing. It&#8217;s been done so long, as tradition &#8212; whether halakic or not &#8212; and the rabbis are sticklers for tradition. </p>
<p>TRADITION!</p>
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		<title>By: Frum But Fun</title>
		<link>http://www.frumsatire.net/2009/04/12/rebel-ashkenazim-begin-to-eat-kitniyot-on-pesach/comment-page-1/#comment-67838</link>
		<dc:creator>Frum But Fun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 23:17:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.frumsatire.net/?p=2196#comment-67838</guid>
		<description>While you&#039;re at it, we may as well reinstate corn and soy.Or lets just repel the potato starch crap and eat normal food addition to matzah.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While you&#8217;re at it, we may as well reinstate corn and soy.Or lets just repel the potato starch crap and eat normal food addition to matzah.</p>
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