This is not a post about fat girls, lots of my fans are of the larger body type – I know this because practically everyone is obese these days. I myself have a stomach that makes me look like I’m pregnant. But it is a post about double standards. So all of you over weight people in the audience including my dear friends – do not be offended.
This conversation with a Saw You At Sinai shadchun transpired recently and was sent over by a fan who wished to remain anonymous.
Ok I understand.
I just don’t understand why it’s acceptable for girls to reject guys for being shorter than them (and also for not being wealthy or from rich families) but if a guy doesn’t want to go out with a girl due to her body type – why is it that we’re looked at as being shallow? Sounds very hypocritical to me. Sounds like a two way street here. I respect and understand her rationale for not wanting to go out, but it doesn’t seem very fair that a guy can’t reject a girl because her body type isn’t appealing to him. As Vice President Joe Biden would say “We’re talkin’ about fairness”.
——- Original Message ——-
Sorry about the rejection- we as shadchanim can only try our best with trying to set ppl up. I know — personally and I know she is very machpid with a guy being taller than her as she is quite a tall girl herself. Hatzlacha, will try to send you other girls
Lori
——- Original Message ——-
Hi, looks like she gave me the Heisman (the new yeshivish word for rejection)
Would you mind telling me why? I’m just curious. Believe me, if it’s physical it wont bother me. I had a girl walk off on a date when she saw I wasn’t 6 feet tall!
-->
{ 101 comments… read them below or add one }
Next Comments →
Who gives a crap about this fat f*ck? DIET!
fat chicks need lovin to
I firmly believe it is wrong to turn poeple down because they are not rich or other petty reasons like that. When it comes to issues of being attracted to the person everyone has their preferences, if the person is wonder and has a “great personality” but is not attractive to you. Why do they push it, better for them to find someone who finds them wonderful and move on. I value the personality, intelligence and humor above all, but if they look horrible my interest is gone, regardless of how smart they are.
I personally like shorter guys but then again, I’m only 5 feet tall so the vast majority of people are taller than me anyways. I’ve run into the opposite problem with height – some short guys [5'2" to 5'4"] have rejected me for being short as they were determined to date tall women.
Guys are short, because of god, not themselves. Its genetic and there is nothing they can do about it. But if a girl is fat, she can almost deffinetly do something about it. Large girls shoul diet, esspecialy since they have the time for it. Guys are in yeshiva and have to go to davening, which limits their free time for excercizing. However girls have little to do each day and if they are overweight, they should do something about and not just B#$%* about how guys are shallow and dont want to go out with them.
andy your a dumbass
I think rejecting a guy because of his height is not different than if a guy rejects a girl if she`s not attractive to him. There is no difference really. It`s all about looks. It sounds dumb, but if I had a boyfriend who was shorter than me, I would feel like I would be the one who had to protect him or something. I like to feel that I`m the lady and he`s the man,you know.
“Large girls shoul diet, esspecialy since they have the time for it. Guys are in yeshiva and have to go to davening, which limits their free time for excercizing. However girls have little to do each day and if they are overweight, they should do something about and not just B#$%* about how guys are shallow and dont want to go out with them.”
What kind of bullshit is this?
Andy I hope you were joking!!How dare you judge someone like that?
Do you realise that there is such a concept as a metabolism and somepeople however much they diet and work out you will not see a change?
And even if it does effect they should diet because there are some shallow people out there who dont care about anything other than their body?
What would YOU do if you were married toa stick and then she doubled her size? you would divorce her??]
it’s people like you who need tochange their mindset and not the girls with their bodies!!
I’ve been only on one Shidduch date so far, mainly because of parnassa, and the girl was bigger than I would have liked her to be, but certainly not huge by any means. After the date I realized it wasn’t going to work out because of a combination of hashkafa and personality as well as a lack of *click* if you will. It has nothing to do with her looks. On another note, Andy you’re a douche, as a bigger guy myself I have faced plenty of rejection (mind you only in the secular world so far) based just on my looks, so bigger girls I understand where you are coming from. Big people need lovin too! And there is more of us to love
andy- you are so sexist!
“Large girls shoul diet, esspecialy since they have the time for it”.
how can you dare say that! even if it is someones fault that they are overwieght, that doesnt mean they have time to diet and excercise! and excercise is not always an option for some people! do you know how many single women i know who are over wieght! do you honestly think that they are not doing anything about it?! did you ever learn ANYTHING about genetics and how that can cause people to be overweight just as much as it can affect people’s height!!sometimes, it is not in our control.
this is why you are probly not married! and keep in mind, just because someone can start out as a size 0 absolutly does not mean they will stay anywhere near that size!!!!!!
UH EXCUSE ME!
Fat is due to a lack of self control or a medical issue! great resaons for a Hiesman!
Short? What the hell can a guy do about short?
andy- you are so sexist!
“if a girl is fat, she can almost deffinetly do something about it. Large girls shoul diet, esspecialy since they have the time for it. ”
i know quite afew overweight single women who need shidduchim. do you honestly think they arent/havent tried to do anything about it! believe it or not the wieghtwatchers/zone/california or any of those other stupid diets DONT WORK! and another shocking piece of information for you- there is this thing called STRESS and hearing things like your “dumbass” comments doesnt help anyone with weight issues. because with weight comes low self esteem and you could seriosly hurt someone by saying that stuff!
k i am really annoyed! this is my third comment and it is not showing up!! what is wrong with this?!?!?!
When I was young and just starting to date (like the first few years
, I would get dismayed (sometimes a little, sometimes a lot) about rejection. Then I grew up and I learned that rejection is very important for the simple reason that if the other person doesn’t see a future with you, it is unfair in the extreme for them to continue dating you in the hopes that something might change. And it is doubly unfair for them to continue dating you for the “free dinners” (Even though I wasn’t naive anymore at that point, I was shocked when a female acquaintance of mine openly said that she does that sometimes). That’s as bad as a nonobservant guy that continues dating a gal for the sex even though he sees no future in the relationship and is looking for someone else. So rejection is fair, and is best done as soon as you realize there is no future for the relationship. Therefore, once I realized this, I was always upfront and didn’t hide any of the “facts” even before the first date – facts like being 5’4″, a little overweight, and balding. Today I am still 5’4″ 
, in great shape (the proper diet and working out really does pay off in many ways), and almost completely bald. In the end I married a girl who is the same height as I am, is thinner than I am, and has a lot more hair than I do.
chossid – Do you realise that there is such a concept as a metabolism and some people however much they diet and work out you will not see a change?
This is complete nonsense for almost everyone. Very few people are so metabolically resistant. But people are quite different from each other, and the kind of diet appropriate for them may differ dramatically. In my case, low fat never worked, restricted calorie never worked, planned meals never worked, “fit for life” never worked, the Israeli army never worked, restricted carbohydrates, however, worked perfectly for 14 years and counting.
As to the previous point that was presented in a most abrasive and immature manner, height can never be changed no matter what you do, while weight can be changed with a little (or a lot) of effort for almost all people.
Andy, you have serious issues and you should be shunned.
ok, andy may have said what he said in the most insensitive way possible, but there is some truth to it. if a girl is overweight, (assuming it is due to an unhealthy lifestyle which is often but of course, not always the case) then they should lose weight if they want to be more attractive to men! it’s no secret that human nature is to judge others on their appearance. you can complain all you want about shallowness, but that’s the way it is. i myself am a girl who lost weight so i think i can speak somewhat fairly.
alright, that is better, but my other comments have mysteriously disapeard into cyberspace. where did they go?
well, this is not going to be as good but who knows. they say the third times a charm!
andy- you are so sexist!
“if a girl is fat, she can almost deffinetly do something about it. Large girls shoul diet, esspecialy since they have the time for it. ”
what makes you think that large girls have time to diet any more than thin girls?! and believe it or not, it may not be their fault! a person- man or woman- could have something in thier genes tht prevents them from being thin just like it can make them short! who are you to judge how much time anyone has free or otherwise!
Andy is crude but essentally correct
i think the trick is to write less. so this better work!
andy- you are sexist! may not be girls fault if over weight! i kno quite a few overwate women who need shidduch and do u really think that they havent tried to lose weight?! do u realize how discouraging it is wen it dont work?!
you could have at least tried to have some tact!
who ever runs this site, please FIX IT!
why do my stupid coments go in and not the ones that actually pertain to the article?!
why do my stupid coments go in and not the ones that actually pertain to the article?!
what the heck?!?! duplicate comment detected?!
andy- you are sexist! cant make assumptions like that- need TACT
Andy is right if you reject a man for being short you are rejecting G-d and are a heretic.
First off, me and hesh were discussing this last night.
For me, there are 2 kinds of overweight women: There is the larger frame, big hips etc, women who are just built like a brick house (anyone know that song eh). Solid earth mama look.
Honestly, I dig women with nice curves.
Then there are women like in BP etc.. They start off being skinny and all and then the kids, overeating, slowing of the metabolism hits. So these ladies basically pile on the pounds on a small frame.
THAT I do not like. It just hangs out, or worse yet, they develop a “Truck” look.
Thats how da jew sees it. take it or leave it
andy- you are sexist!
you have no right to say women have more free time!
are the pics under FLICKR in the rocky mtns by red rocks?
When I was young and just starting to date (like the first few years
, I would get dismayed (sometimes a little, sometimes a lot) about rejection. Then I grew up, and I learned that rejection is very important for the simple reason that if the other person doesn’t see a future with you, it is unfair in the extreme for them to continue dating you in the hopes that something might change. And it is doubly unfair for them to continue dating you for the “free dinners” (Even though I wasn’t naive anymore at that point, I was shocked when a female acquaintance of mine openly said that she does that sometimes). That’s as bad as a nonobservant guy that continues dating a gal for the sex even though he sees no future in the relationship and is looking for someone else. So rejection is fair, and is best done as soon as you realize there is no future for the relationship. Therefore, once I realized this, I was always upfront and didn’t hide any of the “facts” even before the first date – facts like being 5’4″, a little overweight, and balding. Today I am still 5’4″ 
, in great shape (the proper diet and working out really does pay off in many ways), and almost completely bald. In the end I married a girl who is the same height as I am, is thinner than I am, and has a lot more hair than I do.
chossid – Do you realise that there is such a concept as a metabolism and some people however much they diet and work out you will not see a change?
This is complete nonsense for almost everyone. Very few people are so metabolically resistant. But people are quite different from each other, and the kind of diet appropriate for them may differ dramatically. In my case, low fat never worked, restricted calorie never worked, planned meals never worked, “fit for life” never worked, the Israeli army never worked, restricted carbohydrates, however, worked perfectly for 14 years and counting.
As to the previous point that was presented in a most abrasive and immature manner, height can never be changed no matter what you do, while weight can be changed with a little (or a lot) of effort for almost all people.
let me get this straight, the only thing that guys have it worse than girls in the dating pool is height. thats it. here come the violins. i hear them, do you?
well, saying a girl can help being fat and a guy cant is ridiculous. men lose weight quicker than women . this is a known fact. so actually a guy being fat is more at fault if you ask me.
i think andy is right why should i have to stare at a fat women my whole life and since its a mitzva 4 the women to appease there husbands i think they should work on staying skinny stayin skinny is what they should teach them girls in seminary and not rambans on the chumish
FSF #22
Nope there is also not going to the right yeshivot when younger apparently. You know back when you were 14 and had complete control over your life.
Men and women need to be physically attracted to each other before anything else. Marriages have enough problems, last thing you need is 2 people that aren’t attracted to each other.
Many rabbinic authorities have confirmed this, it’s plain old common sense. If one is too short, tall, fat, skinny, ugly or anything else that turns the other one off at first sight, it’s time to move along.
Science has proved that human beings are wired to subconsciously look at certain physical details that hint at physical health / signs of fertility and good genes. Reason for this is very likely survival of the species. Female curves are signs of fertility that have been coded into males, just as men with a muscular V shape will attract more women that a guy built like an “A frame”.
As for riches, they come and go. However, starting off with riches is infintitely better than starting with nothing.
kobeisbetter…. wow, very eloquent. i hope you can actually find a woman, fat or skinny, with that attitude.
Okay, I understand the guys here that say they don`t like curvier women. That`s fine. But the comments have leaned towards almost offensive comments about women who are bigger. There`s no need for that. Everyone has their own preferences, but that doesn`t mean you can insult others who don`t fit into what you like.
Face the facts; Jews are chauvinistic.
face the facts; you’re a cynic
Andy is right, but only to a certain point. The girls that gained wait because they overa te and refuse to exercise have no excuse. Kobe is better than ob ama also says a good point but in a terrible way. Also leb ron is getting engaged any day:)
From what I understand, it’s not a double standard, it’s pretty much the same thing. Many of the “older” single girls I know are overweight or have a large frame and many of the “older” single guys I know are short. Sadly, both these groups seem to have a hard time being set up.
Oh, and, by the way, I had plenty of time to write this comment, since I don’t have to go to davening. NOTHING else to do, you know, being a female.
When I was young and just starting to date (like the first few years
, I would get dismayed (sometimes a little, sometimes a lot) about rejection. Then I grew up and I learned that rejection is very important for the simple reason that if the other person doesn’t see a future with you, it is unfair in the extreme for them to continue dating you in the hopes that something might change. And it is doubly unfair for them to continue dating you for the “free dinners” (Even though I wasn’t naive anymore at that point, I was shocked when a female acquaintance of mine openly said that she does that sometimes). That’s as bad as a nonobservant guy that continues dating a gal for the sex even though he sees no future in the relationship and is looking for someone else. So rejection is fair, and is best done as soon as you realize there is no future for the relationship. Therefore, once I realized this, I was always upfront and didn’t hide any of the “facts” even before the first date – facts like being 5’4″, a little overweight, and balding. Today I am still 5’4″ 
, in great shape (the proper diet and working out really does pay off in many ways), and almost completely bald. In the end I married a girl who is the same height as I am, is thinner than I am, and has a lot more hair than I do.
chossid – Do you realise that there is such a concept as a metabolism and some people however much they diet and work out you will not see a change?
This is complete nonsense for almost everyone. Very few people are so metabolically resistant. But people are quite different from each other, and the kind of diet appropriate for them may differ dramatically. In my case, low fat never worked, restricted calorie never worked, planned meals never worked, “fit for life” never worked, the Israeli army never worked, restricted carbohydrates, however, worked very well for me, 14 years and counting.
As to the previous point that was presented in a most abrasive and immature manner, height can never be changed no matter what you do, while weight can be changed with a little (or a lot) of effort for almost all people.
Andy. I work with patients all the time who have difficulty losing weight. Obesity is a complex medical condition with limited options for treatment interventions. Diet and exercise can certainly sometimes be successful, but their sustainability and degree of weight loss is usually disappointing. If you are not attracted to someone because of their weight, by all means don’t date them. You should, however, at least show them dignity and compassion- even in an anonymous forum
Woa this is what happens when you schedule a post while you are at a wedding
Phil, thanks for the nod to innate biology. Men _are_ more visually oriented than women. It’s hard-wired.
HOWEVER, let me say the big “e” word again: “expectations.” Somehow in this warped secular culture of ours it has seized our Jewish brains until we’re believing that the ideal woman’s figure is a something that 60 years ago would have been reminiscent of a malnourished war survivor — with enormous mammary glands added. Not just the men, but the ladies, too! Ever see the cover of Cosmo? 40 years ago the men’s magazine covers were more modest than that! The beauty symbol of a generation, Marilyn Monroe, by today’s standards would be judged “plump”! What’s going on?
I was chaperoning some girls to a Bnos leader’s convention a few years ago. During the ride, one beautiful, talented, smart, funny, creative senior girl sighed to me, “I’m so fat.” I nearly drove the car off the road. This girl was never going to be size 2… but she is 5’8″ and b”H healthy! She was exactly how she was supposed to be!!! And a great girl!!!!! She disparaged the small curve beneath her waist. She agonized because she had hips. She was shapely, on the way to becoming womanly.
Nothing I said could dissuade her… me, victim of numerous diets, sitting with my extra ___ pounds….
…My heart still aches for her.
That fabulous girl was already setting herself up as a failure. Who told her she was fat? She comes from a great Kollel family, goes to a nice school, only reads Jewish books & Hamodia and listens to Jewish music, has really kind friends, and is a jewel. She’s going to be a fantastic wife, mother, and all that jazz.
But she thinks she’s fat because her tummy is not perfectly flat.
Expectations, my friends, are our downfall. False expectations, and those pegged to a non-existent standard. Yes, a girl needs to be attractive, as the Torah stipulates there must be attraction. But we also need to remember that “beauty is not skin deep.”
DS above said “After the date I realized it wasn’t going to work out because of a combination of hashkafa and personality as well as a lack of *click* if you will. It has nothing to do with her looks.” What a mensch! What maturity!
In a way, we have to be more accepting of prospective partners — like we are with babies. Everybody loves babies, yet if you’re around them long enough, you learn there’s stuff likely to come out of both ends. (And you wear washable stuff.) But reject a baby because he might spit up a bit? That’s unrealistic. We accept the baby for who he/she is and see his/her beauty despite of the diaper.
Just remember this phrase: “Zits happen.”
A short girl 5’5 & under has no right to reject a guy that it not tall,& who do they think thay are ,little shrimp dumpey jewish girls,as if a tall guy if you can find a jewish one would go out with them? They want 5’7- 5’8.As far as`weight these short dumpy looking jewish girls should be happy that a guy would even look at them.However a fat dumpey guy should never ever expect a girl that is not equivilant to him & vice a versa.IN THIS GAME ITS ALL ABOUT LOOKS.Personality & charm helps ,but its all about looks.Unless the girl is a goldigger trash then you could look like shit ,but you are`already a loser piece of shit for letting yourself get used.As far as frumkeit ,that comes after how cute the guy is or how pretty the girl is .IN OTHER WORDS EVERYONE IS FULL OF SHIT,especially if you have internet acces.
You do not see fat people in these kool frum areas- Five Towns ny, Great neck n.y.upper west siden.y. upper east side n.y. crown heights brooklyn.miami beach south florida.Beverly Hills pico california,therefore if someone wants to shut their face & stop eating they can be thin .I do not understand these fat shlubs that go out to eat ,I feel like telling them that I think that it looks like they ate already ,UHHHH I hate fat people ,unkool ,unsophisticated,lazy ,sellfish ,gorge on all dreck.Usually uneducated .Where does fat belong in the frum community ,unfortunatley alot of bal tshuvas are fat fat fat ,did you ever see a real good looking bal tshuva ,no they are having to much of a good time to start to wonder duhhh what am i missing in my life.
Anyone can reject anyone else for whatever reason they want. Unless you are resorting to arranged marriages, there has to be an attraction on some level. One person may find it on the physical level, another on an intelectual one, another on a spiritual one, yet another on a social one. But they have to live together for years, so the decision should be theirs, mutually, whatever their reasons.
As for weight and genes, yes there are genes involved in metabolism and hunger, etc. but ultimatelyvery few people can claim they are unwilling hostages to their genes. The China Study by professor Campbell from Cornell addresses this issue comprehensively and fairly.
Okay, here we go again. Heshy, please remove the duplicates of my post.
Rg 5’5” is short? That must have been the height of the tallest I think I have dated, most were 5’2.” I had to be careful not to step on most of them. I have to bend down to have a conversation with them.
I am ashamed that fellow religious jews have the audacity to be this SHALLOW. do you know how many people suffer eating disorders fueled by social “standards” the media upholds even in frum communities. These comments embody just that.
Rg. you disgust me.
“Where does fat belong in the frum community ,unfortunatley alot of bal tshuvas are fat fat fat ,did you ever see a real good looking bal tshuva ”
how dare you make statements like that? both as a woman who has struggled with an eating disorder growing up and as a BT ( and a student at an ivy league university, you mention uneducated)…. you are one arrogant and ignorant person. good luck leading such a sad sad life my friend.
sorry everyone for my 11 coments. they were not showing up before so i rewrote it a few times. i think i got my point across though..
To all those that misunderstood my post, let me explain. I was not refering to the overweight girl who has a medical issue. I was refering to the majority of overweight girls. The ones who have opportunity to lose weight and dont. Also, so far noone has refuted any of my arguments. People are just calling of names without any explanation of why i am incorrect. I may have been a tad nasty, but i was not wrong or at least i havent been proven wrong yet. So to all you that disagree with my stance, prove me wrong, dont just call me names,because you just sound uneducated and self conscience, without any tact. On a side note, i have dated an overweight girl and had on problem with it, because her obesity was due to a medical issue, not her own lazy ness and self loathing.
Eh. I like my men a little bigger. You like your women a little smaller? You probably aren’t big enough.
(unless you are one of those creepy big men with a tiny wife, which makes you very suspicious.)
Baltimore is the Short Guys Capitol of the frum world. Yes, there are exceptions, but I’m convinced there’s something in the water.
Rg – im 5″1 and love big, tall guys and most of the guys that like me are big and tall. dunno they must like little girls …
anyway, i think i should be able to reject guys for whatever reason i want to reject them and the same goes for the guys. at the end of the day we will have to wake up next to that person for the rest of our lives..
I am a 5’8″ woman and I would date a short guy (say, as short at 5’2″–I’m not sure about shorter than that), but most of them won’t date me. It works both ways.
I’m 5’7″ and would date a girl a lil taller than me, and shorter than me, the girl I told you about earlier, was like 4’11″ and I had no problem with the difference. As for losing the weight, I take after my dad so no matter how much I were to try and lose, I will always be on the husky side, its just how my metabolism and bone structure are. Lastly, as for big guys and lil girls, there is a couple near where I live where the guy is a big guy, both big and tall, and his wife is tiny, which goes to show you, when you find your b’shert G-d knows whats best for you.
RG – Grow Up.
Personality goes a long long way. I am a 5’3 woman. I wear a size 14-16. I have a beautiful face and a perfectly proportioned body.
I have never lacked for dates. My shortest date was 5’11, my tallest was 6’3. None of my dates were fat. One of them was offered a modeling job with Calvin Klein. All of them have at least a six-pack. My husband is 6’3 and is ripped.
All of the people I dated said they loved dating me because of my personality and that I was a genuine, fun person to be with and that I wasn’t shallow or judgemental of others. But they all said one of the reasons they stayed with me was because at the end of the day, when it was all said and done, there was still something for us to talk about and carry on a conversation about.
So after the bedroom, after dealing with the kids all day, the reason our marriage works is not the looks – it’s the friendship and mutual respect and love for each other.
RG – you are going to make one miserable husband
what’s the big deal. Just diet ur fat asses off. height, well u guys cant help that, but doesnt mean we gota like a “little person.” p.s. being a size 0 or 1 isnt the skinniest shit, im that size, and i dont consider myself skinny, im toned, but i eat a lot
suck on that fatties! lol
Wow Jenny, you’re going to make a great wife some day…
hey dont get me wrong, i dont hate fat ppl. i just like making fun of them cuz its hilarious! and that pic with the obese man and that shirt is PRICELESS!
what i don’t get is why so many people either lie, or never wana say how much they weigh. I mean u can look at the person and kinda figure it out somewhat. Unless they hide their flab really well. im 95 pounds yippidy doo da i dont give a crap who knows
Making fun of fat people is like making fun of Jewish people or black people, sure we all do it, we just never admit to it… but yes the shirt is hilarious.
Really, at the end of the day looks aren`t all that important. They are oneof the things that is needed, but believe me personality goes a really long way. I`ve liked people I thought I would never like just because I got to really know them. They were awesome people.
No matter how good looking a person is, if you can`t carry a conversation with them or connect in a meaningful way, then their looks mean nothing.
On an unrelated note, there seems to be a problem with the filter for posting comments. A lot of comments that should be getting posted aren’t, or at least not right away, and a lot of comments that (IMHO) shouldn’t be getting posted are. I don’t think I need to specify which ones, but let’s just say that comments which are just full of hatred and swear words without any constructive or even coherent ideas do not belong on this discussion page.
Now on to the actual topic:
I have never understood the obsession with guys’ height. I once asked a friend who is 5’9 why she doesn’t date guys shorter than her and the best response she could come up with was “It’s just weird.” It makes no sense to me. I’m 5’8, which is one inch shorter than the height of the average American male, but height would not be an issue for me at all in terms of dating. I wouldn’t even make it a very low priority; it just doesn’t matter to me in the slightest. This is, however, assuming no medical conditions of dwarfism or the opposite (I don’t remember the name, but I saw it once in the Guinness Book) are present. That is a different issue entirely.
As far as weight goes, I happen to like heavier guys. Obesity is a turnoff because it’s just unhealthy, and with the exception of those with thyroid disorders, it can be controlled. But I like guys who are slightly overweight, because it makes them cuddlier- like hugging a giant teddy bear
(No, I’m not shomer negiah- gasp!) But I wouldn’t reject a skinny guy if our personalities were compatible.
Anyway, I recognize that these physical attributes do matter greatly to some people. That’s fine; they have every right not to date people who are not attractive to them for whatever reason. And frankly speaking, those people whom they reject out of hand are all the better for it. I have often felt thankful that I am not more attractive for the very reason that it’s a great way to weed out losers. Honestly, I wouldn’t want to date someone that shallow anyway, so he’s doing me a favor by rejecting me. I am not exempt from the societal pressure to look a certain way, and there have been moments when I felt fat or ugly. But I often think that if I were model-thin with a prettier face and had guys throwing themselves at me, I would have to wonder which of them sincerely liked me and which only liked the gorgeous exterior. (By the way, I’m not repulsively unattractive. I’m about 165 lbs with mild acne.)
Andy, I don’t understand your point. You say that girls should diet because they have the time and that guys have no spare time to exercise. I’m going to assume that you meant exercise for both; correct me if that is not the case. (By the way, you try running a household for a day and let me know how much spare time you have. I am not of the camp that automatically relegates women to household duties, but it seems that you are. If you had ever picked up a spatula or a crying child, you might know that it is just as time-consuming as, if not more than, learning and davening.)
Dieting does not take any extra time. It is just about making healthy choices at mealtimes, not starving oneself or binging. It is about eating a good combination of nutrients and satisfying one’s hunger. That doesn’t take any extra time. Exercise can take up a lot of time, but it doesn’t have to. Small lifestyle changes, like taking the stairs instead of the elevator, can really add up, and you’d be surprised at how many different forms of exercise can fit into a busy schedule if you’re willing to be creative. Did you know that treadmills have a jutting spot at the top to put a book? Why not learn a sefer while you’re walking or jogging? Finally, just 30 minutes a day of exercise can lead to weight loss. Are you saying that you don’t have 30 spare minutes per day? How will you interact with your wife once you are married? I can’t speak for any other women out there, but I’m certainly not willing to date a guy who won’t have any time to spend with me.
It seems I’ve written a megillah here. Apologies for the length; hopefully it’ll go through anyway, but if not, I won’t repost it. Others’ comments have shown up later, so maybe that will happen to me too.
Andy. You are a real putz.
Rg, those are not “kool areas” those are non-observant people areas. Also, I think it’s ridiculous that you think a girl 5-5 should consider a guy under 5-7. And seriously, I think the man would have problems psych with a girl shorter than himself.
Hannah, watch the slashes, I think they go to moderation then because anything with a website gets moderated and I think the program thinks it’s a website.
Grapes,
Yeah, if you look like a little girl that gets them all hot.
Jenny,
Just because it’s so easy for you, doesn’t mean it’s so easy for everyone else.
Gila,
The problem is dieting doesn’t do anything. You have to exercise and I can’t afford the women’s gyms, they are like $500 a year.
RG and Andy, you both know you’re a piece of work.
Now, I’m sure guys like that would say I’m fat, but I’m regular sized. I can’t go out in public without getting drooled all over, but, I’m not anorexic and those of you looking for anorexic, would stick your noses up at me.
Gila, I appreciated you writing a Megilah lol, I’m one of those people that need to work out more and eat less, I know that. I also know how much it hurts to get rejected out of hand for being overweight. Lastly, Iknow that if a girl could look past my cuddly belly (I am Shomer but wasn’t always) they would see a really great guy who would go out of his way for the girl. I know I would make a great husband because my mom says so, because I’m apparently a great son
Michal – The problem is dieting doesn’t do anything. You have to exercise and I can’t afford the women’s gyms, they are like $500 a year.
“Dieting” (not meaning depriving oneself of food, but rather eating a proper and healthy diet) does plenty! And you can very easily exercise without a gym membership, even at home if you don’t want to go outside. Sit ups, crunches, push ups, squats, lunges, etc are all very easy to do at home. And if you are particularly ambitious, you can get some dumbbells at the store and use them at home periodically for even better results. And … it’s a mitzvah as well!
no fat chicks…
http://www.aufkm.com/images/104NoFatChicks.jpg
yea!
Some of you are so totally unrealistic. Some women burn like 700 calories a day while men burn like 3,000. As for anaerobic exercise… talk to a trainer, this does very little.
I’m not that big but, even when I used to spend 5 hours a day at the gym and eat granola bars and apples basically nothing else, I was still 140 pounds. Although, I had some ripping on my stomach and I wore a size 5.
It’s not outlandish to want a woman who doesn’t have a double chin and jiggle when she walks. However, this one on here who bragged about being 95 pounds…. contrary to what you men think, all women shouldn’t be under a 100 pounds. That’s actually unhealthy unless she’s like 4 foot 9.
There’s a whole spectrum in between anorexic and obese.
BTW, I have dumbells, too.
It’s pretty funny actually. I’ve never been a “little” girl. I was well over 200 lbs when I met and married my very handsome 6’1″ husband. I never rejected an introduction because the guy was too short – but I’m sure there were plenty of guys who would have said “no thanks” because of my weight.
Now, in my 40′s, with a major health issue eliminated (see, we’re not all fat because of too much nosh..
), I’m a size 12-14, Marilyn Monroe curvy, still 5’10″ and have men around me like other people attract tsuris. Actually, the attention can be a bit of a problem – though it’s nothing I don’t usually handle with good grace.
But at the end of the day, I have to agree with Anonymous: it’s my personality and brains that carry the day. That, and a few other talents I share only with my wonderful husband.
Interesting post/discussion.
It was really interesting to hear what you all had to say. It does seem like a widespread problem with short guys and fat girls being rejected in the shidduch probelm. The only pratical sulotion I could think of is to set short guys up with short girls and fat girls up with fat guys. Either way, at least they will have a common denominator and something to mutually relate to. I don’t see any other reason why should a person be picky with someone within his/her height and weight bracket. If you are short and know that someone taller than you won’t go out with you, then don’t request for a tall person. If you have a weight issue and you know that someone with a better physic won’t give you the time of day for that reason, then don’t ask to be set up with that person. I belive everyone is entitled to their own stipulations within reason. But if you happen to be overweight, don’t turn down someone just because he/she is a little heavy. If you are short, don’t weed out the possibility of going out with someone who may not be much taller than you. Though I understand where some of you people are coming from with your comments. I’ve seen some very curvy women who now looked like they aged 20 years after having their second child; not to mention the excess amount of weight they’ve put on. I’ve seen 6 foot men who shrunk a couple inches as they got older. Its all about time and gravity.
Michal, first of all, no man burns 3,000 calories a day unless he is a professional athlete. That’s a gross exaggeration.
Second, I don’t know how tall you are, but what do you mean “still” 140 pounds? That sounds like a healthy weight to me, and size 5 can be great (again, depending on your height, but unless you’re extremely short I don’t see how you would be very overweight at that size).
Anyway, eating nothing but apples and granola bars is counterproductive. When you deprive your body of the nutrients it needs, it will react by storing up fat and burning calories slower in order to conserve energy- basically the opposite effect of what your goal is. If you want to lose weight, you shouldn’t starve yourself, but maintain a healthy, balanced diet. Likewise, 5 hours at the gym is overdoing it. It sounds like you have some misguided ideas about health and body weight; maybe you should see a nutritionist.
I imagine that most trainers would be biased in terms of aerobic vs. anaerobic exercise, having a personal financial stake in the matter. Nevertheless, I think you’re right- aerobic exercise is much better. Were you responding to someone who suggested the opposite? If so, I missed that post.
“it’s all about time and gravity”
Oy. And the corollary: “if it doesn’t sag, it grows hair.”
Gila: From my perspective, in exercise, like in life, you want the golden medium. Yes, you must have aerobic exercise for caridovascular health and some level of weight management. But you also need strength and balance work to maintain your core and keep able to -d0- the aerobic stuff.
It’s not an “either/or” equation.
Gila – It sounds like you have some misguided ideas about health and body weight; maybe you should see a nutritionist.
I think before the nutritionist, she needs to see a Psychiatrist or a Psychologist. I think there is an eating disorder lurking somewhere. I mean, 140 pounds and size 5 is pretty close to perfect, and not anywhere near huge, and it’s something to worry about for the average height! It’s terrible what society (all of the western ones) have done to women and weight.
Mark – that is absolutely right. What kind of a world do we live in where there is only one, rigid standard of physical beauty based, not on what G-d has created in multiple forms, but on what is marketed to us? Oy!
AV – What kind of a world do we live in where there is only one, rigid standard of physical beauty based, not on what G-d has created in multiple forms, but on what is marketed to us? Oy!
But in reality, there isn’t only “one standard”, in the end, larger people and smaller people find their zivug, taller and shorter find theirs, and smarter and dimmer find theirs, funnier and serious-er find theirs, and frummer and less frum find their zivug, hairier and balder, etc…
As we say in Danish, “Some like one thing, others prefer another, that way all the sandwiches get eaten and all the girls get married.”
AV
Nice one AV. The Orig. poster has a point, there are women out there who think it is EVIL to complain about a woman’s weight, but just fine to complain about any man under 6 feet. Those who do both of these are hypocritical, and need to pick a direction to go when it comes to appearances. Obviously, some here are ok with being physically biased or not altogether, and at least they are consistent.
Gila,
Haven’t you heard? Anything over a 4 is fat according to most men. Size 5 is not good enough.
At one point, I was 140 and about 5-1 (size 12). Later on, I was about 140 and 5-4 and there was a huge difference-size 5.
As for the aerobic/anaerobic balance, I was taught, to balance the two. The anerobic doesn’t itself burn calories but, it raises your metabolism for the next two hours. So, I was taught to do a half hour of anaerobic followed by a half hour of aerobic. I used to do about fours sets of that and I probably wasn’t at the gym EVERY day but, I’m just mad at the way these guys want a stick. They all want a stick. What happened to men wanting big boobs? Sticks don’t have that?
Mark,
I was the size 5, 14o… well not anymore… but, guys consider that fat. I’m glad you see that this is normal. Most guys think anything over 130 pounds is big. They think a normal weight should be 90 to 125 lbs. If you weigh 126, you’re fat, obese even..
As for your statement that there isn’t just one standard, that’s the point, there is and people aren’t getting married because of it.
Michal, you sound pretty bitter. I’m sorry if you have had bad experiences, but please understand that not all men are that shallow or have such unrealistic expectations. I know plenty of overweight women who are happily married. Easily the majority of married women I know are far from “sticks”. That’s because it’s neither healthy nor practically possible to maintain a size 00 body. I’m not saying that there aren’t plenty of judgmental men out there, but a) don’t feel like you have to lose weight to please them, since that type will never be happy, and b) there are also plenty of nonjudgmental men out there who will love you at size 12. Keep looking for them.
I’m confused about the aerobic/anaerobic exercise. First you said that anaerobic doesn’t do anything; now you say you were taught to balance the two? Which is it?
Neither on it’s own is very productive. They have to be combined.
Jason: No one can help what/to whom they are physically attracted. But that doesn’t mean a person has to defend that choice by deriding that of others.
5 looks splendid on some ladies; a 16 better on others. We’d never have this guilt-laden, condemnatory tone to a conversation about, say, shoe size… Stay healthy, daven, give tzedakah and enjoy your life. It’s sure as heck not the dress rehersal – regardless of your dress size.
Michal – As for the aerobic/anaerobic balance, I was taught, to balance the two. The anerobic doesn’t itself burn calories but, it raises your metabolism for the next two hours.
Not quite true. Both aerobic and anaerobic exercises burn calories. However, aerobic exercises also speeds up your metabolism for about 24 to 48 hours which causes your body to burn more calories that it normally would have during those 24 to 48 hours. That’s the “magic” of aerobic exercise when it comes to weight reduction.
Michal – but, I’m just mad at the way these guys want a stick. They all want a stick. What happened to men wanting big boobs? Sticks don’t have that?
You must have had some pretty bad experiences (as I did way back when I was single and still immature) to be that mad. But there is one important (maybe the most important) thing to realize, the guys that “want a stick” are not the guys that you want in the first place, and the fact that they aren’t interested IS A PLUS from your point of view because it automatically weeds them out and avoids wasting your time and your potential heartache. Once I internalized that, my dating life was much better, much more productive (more potential marriage material), and far more enjoyable.
Why don’t you go to a bedroom community one shabbat and simply observe all the young married women. I think you will be surprised to notice that they come in all sizes and shapes. And that is true both before and after their pregnancies.
bedroom community? What’s that? Well, Shadchans try to push the beis yaakov girls on everyone and try to THEM married, so, I don’t doubt that there’s big by girls that are married. Some others….
Michal – bedroom community? What’s that?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bedroom_community
For the purpose of this survey, just any place that has a lot of young married couples.
SOMEBODY!!! HOLD ME BAAACK!!!
*hand shaking violently*
*stabs Andy*
Try asian girls, 90% of them are slim for some reason, without any exercise whatsoever!
Oh, well, if you will, be careful, because you don’t want to get labeled with that ol’ “fever”…
Andy you are totally correct.
If you dont eat, you WILL NOT be fat. You dont get fat people in Ethiopia or Somalia, even though there should be people there who are also ‘genetically’ fat. It is extremely rare for obesity to be due to a disorder. The vast majority of the time it is because of a lack of self control. Call it what you will, stress, anxiety, whatever, but it all comes down to self control at the end of the day.
I am a rather large specimen myself, and I can tell you with authority that it is because I eat too much. I love eating food and I find it too difficult to muster up the will to eat considerably less.
All the fat people I know eat too much. They may have slow metabolisms but what difference does that make? It just means they need to eat less than the average person. If you burn up less energy, hooray, you need less fuel to live!
Dale- you know of any Jewish Asian chicks you can hook me up with?
Glasses, I love it
Dale, that’s a crock, the gyms are full of Asian girls. Plus, they are raised that having a man is UBER important and so they all eat like tofu and rice.
Chraam, Asian girls don’t do fat.
Chraam, malnutrition and starvation is a totally different issue. A starving person’s body defies the natural order of things in more ways than just genetic body size. For example, a starving woman will stop menstruating, and a starving girl will not start menstruating. In both cases, their cycles will start or return once they begin eating nutritiously. I sincerely hope you’re not suggesting that overweight people starve themselves, as this is a step backwards. The ideal is a healthy, balanced diet, not “whatever it takes” to get down to a size 0. You seem to mistakenly believe that anyone is capable of shrinking to that size; it’s simply not possible for some, no matter how much they diet.
On a separate note, if you actually observe starving children in Ethiopia, you’ll notice that their bellies are distended. According to you, they should be flat, or else it means that the children are eating too much. In actual fact, swelling of the abdomen is a common side effect of malnutrition. Where does that leave your theory?
Michal, is there a stereotype on earth that you don’t subscribe to?
They should ban soda from ALL kiddushes.
That would at least begin to deflate the issue of obesity in the FRUM community (men & women).
gila you are very wrong, well your kinda right, but the way you worded it, those african kids with swollen bellies are malnurished, but not from eating too little. There problem is they run low on food and turn to drinking water to fill their stomachs, the water causes the swelling of the abdomen as the body is trying to desperately feed off the water, but to no avail as water contains no calories. Now if a fat chick was to drink a sensible about of water and not eat (become malnurished) for an extensive period of time, lets say a month, then she would lose a minimum of half her bodyweight, some fat but mostly muscle. Yes muscle, every obese person has alot more muscle then the average person (unless you lift weights) but this muscle just sits there, its hardly used, its built up by protein, its what usually holds the fat in pplace, thats why you see varyious different body shapes for people obese on the same level. Any way, stick to 1 meal a day (lunch) of something health like a bowl of muesli, and havve a banana in the morning and before you go to sleep and you will drop weight fast, will be noticeable within a week
Sunny, you’re not making any sense, unless I’m simply misunderstanding your point (did you actually have one? it’s hard to tell what with all the run-on sentences and spelling errors.)
“those african kids with swollen bellies are malnurished [sic], but not from eating too little.”
Huh??
“Now if a fat chick was [sic] to drink a sensible about [sic] of water and not eat (become malnurished) [sic] for an extensive period of time, lets [sic] say a month, then she would lose a minimum of half her bodyweight [sic], some fat but mostly muscle.”
The term “chick” is highly offensive, but leaving that aside, this comment is almost laughable. No one could go a month without eating anything and only drinking water. She would last about 8-9 days before dying of starvation.
“Anyway, stick to 1 meal a day (lunch) of something health [sic] like a bowl of muesli, and havve [sic] a banana in the morning and before you go to sleep and you will drop weight fast, will be noticeable within a week”
Sure, a diet of two bananas and a bowl of muesli a day will cause a person to lose weight. But it’s completely unhealthy. Muesli and bananas are healthful foods, but they are not beneficial unless they are eaten as part of a balanced diet. How is the dieter supposed to get all of his/her essential vitamins and nutrients from such a scant diet? Basically, in such a scenario, the body’s metabolism would slow down so as to reserve stores of fat once it notices that it is not getting enough food. This makes the diet very counterproductive. If you want to lose weight at ANY COST, this will work, but trust me, it’s not worth it.
After reading all the comments, it would appear Andy is tactless, but essentially correct
Next Comments →