Obviously everyone’s talking about it, but I have yet to see more then anyone talking about. If you pick up any charedi publication like the Yated, Binah, Mishpocha, etc… you will see whole issues devoted to this so called crisis. But a quick look at the Jewish Press, World Jewish Digest, Forward, Jewish Week, etc… will reveal that it seems the only people talking about the crisis are yeshiva/charedi type people. Funny because the last time I looked, the large communities of single were made up of people fairly removed from Mishpocha Magazine’s readership.
In the Charedi world it doesn’t seem to be progressing in light of the shidduch crisis. You rarely hear about frummies meeting through the internet, singles events etc… rather the age old matchmaker with ridiculous questions is still the method of choice. Girls get redd to a boy and then they go through a rsearch project longer then some PhD dissertations- to find out that the girls Grandfather wasn’t frum and there goes weeks of back round checks.
I am not writing this to talk about those stupid checks, stupid questions and ridiculous wants and desires. I just want to know where this so called crisis is? When they discovered it? Because it seems like every few years the papers need something to talk about. Anyone remember kids at risk, bugs in water, bigs in veggies, Indian sheitles?
If someone were to tell me there are more single then ever, I would say that I have to disagree. I grew up going to singles shabbatons with my dad, they have always had them. Just now you have a proliferation of young girls- convinced by their communities that 22 is old- online and writing about their sorrows. There are numerous “I am in the shidduch parshah” blogs, and they are almost always written by yeshivish/BY type girls, who are jealous that their friends are getting married- and then we all the sudden have a crisis, to make everyone rage with fear or the problem. No solutions of course as of yet.
Jen emailed me this comment from the yeshiva world news- if this is what we are dealing with, this “crisis” will only get worse.Original Article!
Confused in Teanek!!
Im really confused about you! I closely followed the articals in the Hamodia since i am obviously up to that stage. I agree that there are many stigmas in shidduchim that are compelely unfounded and untrue. However, i totally and completely disagree with you comment that a working boy is not a stigma! Of course it is! Working boys are second class citizens. A boy’s tachlis on this earth is to learn and delve into Hashem’s heilige torah! He should be constantly swaeting adn toiling in Torah. My heart cries for all these bums who have seeped to such low levels that they have actually left the the torah learning and have entereed the goyesha work field. Don’t they realize how wrong that is!! I daven for them every day that they should realize how wrong they are and how messed up they are! There is absolutely no reason at all why they are sitting behind a desk all busy with work instead of sitting in a bais hemedrish learning and shteiging in Torah.
I went to one of the top institutions in Eretz Yisroel and learned so much and one thing that our teachers repeated over and over again and engrained in our blood that we must marry a learning boy! They have much better yiras shamayim and more derech eretz than those working boys. Learning boys are much better off and are great boys. I would never be able to marry a working boy becuase i feel that i would never be able to respect him at all since he stooped to the the level of working! I think that NO ONE should begin working until there is absolutely no money left in the mother’s pocketbook and there is only moldy bread left on the shelves. Until that happens, then the husband should be sitting in the bais hamedrish.
I know that many poeple will not be happy with this letter adn think that its extreme, however thes are the values that i was engraiend in seminar, and i feel that i don’t have to compromise. The person as mentioned above in the letter will have a harder time with shidduchim so unfortunately may nebach have to marry someone who is working. My heart goes out to her, but that may be the hishtadlus that she has to do. but for the rest of us NORMAL girls, i see no reason why i should marry a working boy? im curious what other opinions are on this topic!
I leave you with my second most viewed video on You Tube- which is my shidduch crisis rant:
36 responses so far ↓
1 A23 // Mar 12, 2008 at 10:46 am
Hesh,
You’re not the only one writing satire. This comment from YW was clearly made in jest. Do you really take it at face value?
2 heshman // Mar 12, 2008 at 10:55 am
Nope, I think its a joke, but it seems that someone to write something of the sort- may be serious- look at the spelling and grammar, I am not even that bad. Also most of the comments on that site are that scary.
3 Sarah // Mar 12, 2008 at 10:56 am
Please tell me that comment from the Yeshiva World News was not real. How sad.
4 Frum Punk // Mar 12, 2008 at 11:29 am
The singles crises was invented by the people who run singles shabbatons at $50 a weekend.
And winter was invented by clothes manufacturers.
5 frumcollegegirl // Mar 12, 2008 at 12:13 pm
for someone who is as fed up with the whole shidduch crisis as you say you are, you sure spend alot of time talking about it…
6 heshman // Mar 12, 2008 at 12:28 pm
I love to talk about it, its of major interest, I love the whole concept its hilarious.
Besides its easy to make fun of and everyone likes it.
I also talk about food, and mechitzas a lot.
7 stacy // Mar 12, 2008 at 12:42 pm
yw- do you realize ten years from now when you have your 6-7 kids and are 9 months pregnant you will still be going to your 7 dollar per hour secretary job -no degree remember?- youre husband will still be sitting all day “learning”?
i went to a BY school too and heard the same garbage btw if someone seriously wants to learn there are plenty of hours in the day including shabbos
8 none // Mar 12, 2008 at 1:05 pm
Hey,
Some of your posts are funny, you are a talented writer and social observer. However, that being said, a lot of your posts are completely illogical and insensitive.
The fact is that there are many single girls and guys out there and it is a crisis. It’s not funny when people (whether Jewish or not) are lonely, not getting married and not able to build families together. Open your eyes and look around at how many single people there are out there in both the religious and secular world. It is sad and don’t try to deny that-or you will come across as insensitive. Crisis is just a word that is used to describe the overall situation within our community. And yes, it can be describes as a crisis, a catastrophe, or any other word you would like to use..
The reason the frummer communities are more outspoken about the singles situation then more modern communities, is because modern people tend to pursue careers and education and don’t usually focus as much on getting married as more right wing communities.
Every girl and guy should be able to find someone they love, get married and build a family with their partner. And, every parent of a child has the right to want to to see their children get married to somebody who will be a good partner for their child, and see grandchildren brought into the world before they die. Every parent cares about their child and wants the best for them. It’s not going to be funny when there are many single girls in the community who are childless because its to late to have children. A huge part of Judiasm is all about family and carrying on the tradition that was handed down to us. Some of us will not have that opportunity… There is more to life then getting into a Ivy league school and having a great career. And there is more to life then living the “Sex In the City” lifestyle.
If you want to offer solutions thats one thing, but don’t downplay and try to make it like there isnt a huge sad problem..
Good luck with your love life buddy.
9 menashe // Mar 12, 2008 at 1:13 pm
That comment is absurd. It is a hiddush in the frum world for entire communities to have the majority of their men sitting and learning. This is nonsense and has NEVER been the derech of the Torah. Our greatest chachamim all worked at one point and the privilege of sitting and learning for one’s entire life was always reserved for those that could afford it and the biggest talmidei chochamim. These were usually the same people. No coincidence that the wealthiest fathers in law usually married off their daughters to the biggest talmidei chochamim. Those that could afford to learn without putting a burden on their communities did. The rest were “moser nefesh” and faced the facts and actually supported themselves without resorting to handouts. The fact is that many of these folks are causing yeshivos to go bankrupt from not paying their tuition bills and much hardship and stress on wives and parents to support Torah learning.
If you can afford it and you’re not just taking up space in a beis midrash, then by all means, its a big mitzvah to sit and learn. But in reality that is not what’s happening. This girl has been indoctrinated into propoganda, pure and simple.
10 heshman // Mar 12, 2008 at 1:50 pm
I have asked my Rebbe once what percentage of people should be learning full time of the ones that do- he responded that maybe 5% were actually learning.
Its great what you say None- but with the cost of raising a family you cannot just say to put all the burden on parents and wives.
What you need to understand is that in the last few years costs have risen to absurd amounts- prob in one way or another due to GWBush.
The shidduch crisis will not end until parents stop with this crap about finding this and that and just letting their kids date.
So are saying that all modern people live a sex and the city lifestyle. Funny because the yeshiva community has brainwashed these girls so much that when they are not married by age 22 many of them go to the other extreme- just go to the UWS and see how many EX-BY girls you will find- who were insulted at the crap that you people pull in the shidduch world.
With that said, I don’t think the yeshiva world has a crisis- and calling it a crisis just makes people fear, the problem is they never pose any solutions.
Give me a solution and prove to me that it does exist.
11 Christopher Wadham // Mar 12, 2008 at 3:24 pm
For as long as I can cognitively remember people have been kvetching about the shidduch crisis. It has never been a flavor of the month issue like indian shaitels, bugs in the water etc. Those issues came and went. But there’s always been this shidduch crisis. Its a persistent longstanding problem.
12 jennthejewess // Mar 12, 2008 at 4:21 pm
Hey…the letter is in fact fake…sorry hesh…here is here response
——————————————————————————–
ok so basically i made a big mistake today. I read the original letter today and figured why not have some fun and write an extreme letter to see what people think. I actually wanted to condone an experimnet and see how people would handle such a post. So i wrote it in, and did not have such a fun day ever in my entire life! First of all, im sorry if hurt anyone’s feelings! I was completely joking! I do not feel at all that it is wrong for people to work! But what made me really nervous was how people are so quick to judge, comment, and bash seminaries. (this im serious about!) i put in the 2 lines about my seminary having an effect of what kind of boy i want to marry, and suddenly many people posted bashing all the seminaries and waht they teach us. And i didn’t chas v’shalom mean to call anyone bums. I completely made up anything and once again apologize for any hurt feelings.
Whatever it is…there really are ppl who have that view and thats the sad part….
13 heshman // Mar 12, 2008 at 4:51 pm
I knew it was a fake, and it was funny, unfortunately there are people that have that view-
This is just like a while back when I did that ridiculous shidduch questions post which I didn’t say if it was fact or fiction- and most people felt it was real, until I admitted it, proving my point.
14 stacy // Mar 12, 2008 at 5:17 pm
it kind of doesnt matter that its a fake bc open most jewish newspapers or websites and youll basically hear the same thing
most seminaries and high schools deserve the bashing
15 utubefan // Mar 12, 2008 at 7:30 pm
There are more Yeshivish single women in their 30’s and up than in the last 20 years since I had first begun dating. I do believe there is a crisis and it is as a result of the kollel obsession, the fact that many are not attending college where so many “frum” kids used to meet and if they do go to college they have to go to Touro for G-d’s sake, the fact that there probably are statistically more girls than boys, and that these terrible, awful questions and destructive sifting out the “chaff” from the wheat crap. There’s hardly any freaking wheat and what becomes of what they say is the “chaff?” Blowin’ in the wind at 30, at 35, at 40. And they can’t go to singles events in their circles and when they finally do go, they are already “old maids” in their 30’s when the Yeshivish crowd winks and nods if you attend a mixer because you’re so freakin old and by then even the scary old, weird guys who zero in on you at an event, don’t want to hit on you. You can mock if you want, but there is a crisis of sorts in the Yeshiva world and, of course, none of the leaders are doing a damn thing about it.
16 Maddox // Mar 12, 2008 at 7:53 pm
Maybe there’s more girls than guys because we used to able to have multiple wives so god increased the female stats and nothings changed.
Anyway, my comment didnt go up earlier I emailed it to you. post thanx
17 Child Ish Behavior // Mar 12, 2008 at 7:59 pm
All of you are laughing thinking the whole comment is a joke. The natural progression of the line of reasoning depicted by the typical yeshiva today is exactly that. Men are forced into 3 diverging paths
a) believe they are doing wrong by going to work
b) become a cynic and pock fun at everything
c) sit and shtayg all day (Oy vay)
Girls are told to choose C. Then B. Then after all the choices are used up Bidieved A. And why not after all “why were we put on this earth….” and “do your minimum hishtadlus” and “If you have a lot of bituchon, you may win the lottery.” etc.
I even heard this story where a fellow was praised for having 13 children and not working a day in his life. He then got a yirusha for some dude who left all his money to the person with the most kids in town. The moral of the story is, sit and learn you may get lucky someday, when things are so bad you may just have to give up.
Go Figure; people should be more realistic. They should focus on things that have reasonable and practical way of implementation. Instead they create a old fashioned pyramid scheme. It must collapse in the long run.
18 In the Parshah // Mar 12, 2008 at 8:00 pm
Crisis Shmises- if there was really a crisis they would be doing more then write crappy articles in the yeshiva world news. Articles just spread the BS. We talk and talk, but no one does anything.
As you tube said- the yeshiva world will wake up when there are loads of singles and maybe decide the kollel idea when no one even afford tuition is awfully ridiculous.
Then suddenly they may say, wow we should stop asking about yichus, family status and seminary attended and focus on real issues, like not taking 3 weeks so I can go on a 3 hour date.
19 Chava // Mar 12, 2008 at 8:01 pm
I say we call it “stupid parents” crisis! Or crazy shadchun crisis? How bout it guys.
20 HeadBanger // Mar 12, 2008 at 11:07 pm
How about the “do whatever the hell you want crisis”
21 noch a loser // Mar 13, 2008 at 6:49 am
don’t even get me started! the person who wrote that article in YWN probably has a rich father or in laws shtupping them with untold amounts of cash, while the rest of ex-yeshiva guys are working so we can barely pay the bills in NY…even if you are making close to 100K and are just renting an apt.
I love the guys who are learning and gettingshtupped thinking they are so chashuv (puke).
I am not a yeshiva hater….just nauseated at times. Welcome to the real world.
22 stacy // Mar 13, 2008 at 8:27 am
its good to be here…..
23 Anonymous // Mar 13, 2008 at 8:27 am
Great comment Child ish
24 Ahuva // Mar 13, 2008 at 4:01 pm
Those Hamodia articles really freaked me out… not because of the shidduch crisis, but because of the whole “foster children are tainted” and “every boy should either learn or be wishing that he could afford to sit in yeshiva all day and learn” attitudes.
Girls not being married by 22 is not a crisis. There are, however, a lot of single/divorced people in their 30s and 40s. That worries me.
25 Hesh // Mar 13, 2008 at 6:49 pm
The problem is that there have always been just as many singles in their 30’s and 40’s and older. I grew up with them. I have been to countless older ppl singles events, they have been going on for 20 years.
I think the invention of the Internet with everyone spewing at once has made everyone aware of what has been going on for years.
26 chnyock // Mar 13, 2008 at 7:26 pm
i know a few wonderful talented girls who have tried their hardest and are still single pushing 30
its no joke to the people whe get left out…
27 heshman // Mar 13, 2008 at 9:49 pm
Heimishe in BP left this comment but it wouldn’t post for some reason.
I read something the other week an article about the crisis, and I was surprised to see an explanation as to why there is a shiduch crisis in the Orthodox (not MO) community, that actually made some sense. I will try to relay it in a simplistic form that hopefully will make sense to the public.
Some ppl did a study about the Orthodox population going back some e30-40 years, and concluded that orthodox Judiasm as a whole expands at a rate of about 4-5 % a year.
Another fact, generally, its 50-50 boys and girls, born each year.
Another fact, as apposed to the chassidish/heimish community, where both of the sexes are of about the same age at marriage, in the Yeshivish/litvish/American community the average male is 22-24 and the average female is 18-20, at time of marriage. So for arguments sake lets say there is a 4 year difference.
So if for instance in 1980, there were 100 males and 100 females born, then in the year 1981 = 104 of each, 1982 = 108 of each, 1983 = 112 of each, and 1984 = 116, roughly. Fast forward to year 2004, when the 100 males born in 1980 are getting married, and looking for shidduchim, the amount of females looking for shidduchim are 116, who were born in in 1984. thats a surplus of about 15%. That happens year, after,year after year. So from a mathimatical point of view, add all the females that were not so lucky to find their bashert from all the years and that is pretty scary and sad.
28 rach // Mar 14, 2008 at 12:10 am
I think minor setback would be a more appropriate term than crisis. I think we should reserve the word crisis for things like the war on drugs, the oil crisis, or the homeland security crisis. The government already has done a phenomenal job with word.
Oh and for the record, I’m female, single and quite happy…I think there’s more of these types out there than those facing a minor setback. But naturally, the small majority makes the most noise.
29 Yochanan // Mar 14, 2008 at 12:15 am
My 2 cents:
Maybe these 30 year old never married woman would’ve been married in their mid-twenties if the cutoff wasn’t at 22. I’m not saying they should take forever, but that the age 22 cutoff probably makes them so unstable that the shidduch crisis becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
30 Heimishe in BP // Mar 14, 2008 at 7:21 am
I read something the other week an article about the crisis, and I was surprised to see an explanation as to why there is a shiduch crisis in the Orthodox (not MO) community, that actually made some sense. I will try to relay it in a simplistic form that hopefully will make sense to the public.
Some ppl did a study about the Orthodox population going back some e30-40 years, and concluded that orthodox Judiasm as a whole expands at a rate of about 4-5 % a year.
Another fact, generally, its 50-50 boys and girls, born each year.
Another fact, as apposed to the chassidish/heimish community, where both of the sexes are of about the same age at marriage, in the Yeshivish/litvish/American community the average male is 22-24 and the average female is 18-20, at time of marriage. So for arguments sake lets say there is a 4 year difference.
So if for instance in 1980, there were 100 males and 100 females born, then in the year 1981 = 104 of each, 1982 = 108 of each, 1983 = 112 of each, and 1984 = 116, roughly. Fast forward to year 2004, when the 100 males born in 1980 are getting married, and looking for shidduchim, the amount of females looking for shidduchim are 116, who were born in in 1984. thats a surplus of about 15%. That happens year, after,year after year. So from a mathimatical point of view, add all the females that were not so lucky to find their bashert from all the years and that is pretty scary and sad.
31 Pissed off in Queens // Mar 14, 2008 at 7:32 am
If what your saying is true, there would have been an ongoing shidduch crisis throughout history- it makes no sense.
This study is the biggest load of crap. Who did the study? What journal was it published in? How large was the sample set? And you said “some people” were these people PhD types or local orthodox rabbis/shachunim. Anyone can site studies- but please cite your sources. Give us a link.
If it is based on assumptions- then we can assume nothing. Who says the rate is the same every year- everything changes- the environment is not a vacuum.
This also means that there would be a heck of a lot more focus on solving this issue. There has not been any focus, they do forums, articles and speeches. What about the people who are going through this “crisis” (I obviously agree with Hesh over here) Shouldn’t there be some sort of progression against the old way of making shidduchim.
The traditional yeshivishe back round checks, crazy questions, focusing on finding exactly the right boy- rather then let one date materialize. Then you have the kollel situation which is completely out of hand.
The stigmas are only being reinforced by the stupidity seen in the comments section of the Yeshiva World website- one look at the comments and you feel like a Democrat during the 2004 elections. You feel scared for the community.
Maybe the comment listed above was fake, but the fact that no response on the website really attacked it and that they felt it to be “normal” is scary. I am a part of this community- out of the box they say- but still I have watched as siblings had to go through the ridiculous questions of money and seminary attendance and have been disgusted by the shtus that permeates the yeshiva shidduch world- that I almost feel that parents deserve a crisis to light a fire under their tuchus as they say.
32 heimish in bp // Mar 14, 2008 at 8:55 am
To be honest with you it was a few weeks ago, in either the Hamodia or Binah, I know its not as Reliable as the NY Times, ahem ahem, but they had all the sources, and the names of who did the studies.
And no, this is not throughout history, because: a)the expansion rate is only a recent development, i guess it might have to do with the Baby Boomer generation having so many kids, and b) this sitting and learning till 24 is also a knew phenonminom (cant spell), I think.
And besides of just being pessimistic and doubtful about the study, which is being a smart reader, you haven’t really negated the study with any substance.
And you sound very upset on the study as if it really hurt you or something, sorry if it did. I just tried to shed some light on the situation. Take it for what its worth.
33 heshman // Mar 14, 2008 at 9:19 am
Hey hiemishe I fixed the comments as you can see- but that means I am going to get royally spammed. It had something to do with my filters.
34 heimish in bp // Mar 14, 2008 at 9:31 am
you have already, sorry, put it back on, and if i have the problem again i will email them to you so you can put them on, if you dont mind.
Sorry, ask your Host, how we can get around this issue, if possible.\
35 The Babysitter // Mar 16, 2008 at 6:04 pm
that comment from YW just made me nauseous. I can’t imagine someone seriously thinking that way.
36 Phil // Aug 6, 2008 at 9:44 pm
My guess is that the so called crisis was created by the fact that proportionally, more boys go “off the derech” than girls. They then become “damaged” goods for girls on that level. Example, the modern Satmar marrying bais yaakov girl, instead of bais sarah or bais whatever.
Eventualy, you have too many girls left out, I think it’s high time to get rid of the ban by Rabeinu Gershom. Allowing multiple wives will really alleviate some of the issues, one can work, while the other cooks and babysits, etc. Besides, all those cheating men will be too busy once the wives get jealous and start fighting for the rights to have him for a night. Alright, I think it’s past my bed time…
Leave a Comment