As many of you know in the past I have written about two end the madness shabbatons ( the first one) (The second one)I have attended, and although they were shall we say “a bissle shvach” I still like the organization and think Chananya Wiesman the founder of End the Madness is doing a great job to try and shed some light on the problems with the shidduch world. I recently received this email from him and wanted to share it with you. I am curious to hear your insights.
THE BEGINNING OF END THE MADNESS
When I first started End The Madness, I never envisioned it being any more than a web site. The main section would outline the essence of what was really wrong with the shidduch world, explain why conventional attempts to solve the problems were doomed to failure or very limited success, and present a solution that would address the root cause of the problems — namely, a corruption of Jewish values and thinking. Those who agreed (and I was sure there were many such people scattered about the Jewish world) would sign a “covenant” of basic Jewish principles that had somehow become controversial, and thereby give chizuk to their like-minded brethren who felt trapped in a system that they knew was corrupt.
Those who were uninformed would be educated, those who felt isolated would see they were far from alone, and those who felt compelled to make choices that weren’t right for them would see that they had a choice after all. Those who were convinced that everything was just fine and the problem was television, secular studies, or some such thing were more than free to continue on their merry way. The idea was never to change the minds of those who are essentially out of reach, but to give support and helpful information to everyone else.
There was no single life-altering event that galvanized me to create ETM, but rather a culmination of years of witnessing the madness. (Those who suspect that I created ETM as a response to personal difficulties are way, way off — I hadn’t even started dating. Those who jump to other conclusions about ETM tend to be similarly way off.)
One event that comes to mind was the graduation ceremony of my sister from a Bais Yaakov high school (separate seating, of course, since apparently no one could be trusted to behave themselves). The principal wished the girls a mazal tov and quipped that “now you’re kallah maidels”. The girls giggled, the audience laughed, and good times were had by all. Except one young man in the audience, who saw madness. After all, the school had a rule that any student caught speaking to a boy would be summarily expelled. My own sister had some explaining to do after being seen with me in a pizza store, and the emissary of Big Brother didn’t know that I was HER big brother. So the girls were supposed to go from interacting in any way with their male counterparts as the most forbidden of all forbiddens to establishing a successful marital relationship with one of these people with little delay. Makes a whole lot of sense, if you’re insane.
The other incident that sticks out in my mind is a series of lectures I attended on the topic of shidduchim. I went to hear what people were being told. What they were being told included the following:
One should preferably not date a ba’alas teshuva because one would then not have observant in-laws to visit for Yom Tov.
If the mother of the girl one is dating is a “fat woman who watches television all day”, that’s what the girl will be like in 20 years. It was stated just like that, as a fact.
People who are unmarried should not set up their single friends on dates. Apparently this mitzva and most important personal favor is reserved for married people, who, one assumes, knows what they’re doing so much better. Of course. All those married shadchanim are doing such a fabulous job that the immediate friends of singles have no business making an introduction. Heck, I only wonder why he didn’t suggest (or, rather, rule) that only people who have been happily married for 20 years or more should set people up. Why not go all the way with the idea?
What disturbed me most about these lectures was not the outrageous things the standing-room-only crowd of 20-ish yeshiva and college students were being told. What disturbed me most was the way they were furiously scribbling down notes, and no one thought to question, let alone challenge, some of the things they were being told. I wondered how many of these people would break up with someone they were dating because of what they were being told. I wondered how many shidduchim that should happen would not. I wondered what the rabbis making these comments would say in the next world to explain themselves before the ultimate court.
Shortly thereafter it dawned on me that I needed to do more than vent to those I know (who, God bless them, were subjected to many impassioned monologues in those days). I needed to help spread a different message. And the Internet was just the powerful tool that would allow me to communicate this message and unite like-minded Jews in a grassroots campaign.
One day the following summer I wrote the text of the main section of the ETM web site in one feverish, inspired sitting. I then arranged to meet a longtime friend and chavrusa in the waiting area in Penn Station, where I told him my crazy idea to change the world. He liked it as much as I did, and agreed to serve as the volunteer webmaster for EndTheMadness. We registered the domain name 5 years ago today, October 8, 2007.
I shared a printout of the text with Rabbi Moshe Tendler the following school year, and he suggested some edits. (To those who are vitally concerned about these things, I never asked him for permission to go ahead with the project, just for any input he might have had.) I was convinced that once people saw the message the changes would come about in a flash. I was so confident that I bragged to Rabbi Tendler that everything would be fixed in a year. He replied that it would take ten years.
Well, so far it’s clear that my prediction was wrong, and I only hope that his turns out to be right. Ten years to produce a monumental social change isn’t bad, either.
A short time later the web site went up with the main text, the covenant, and the signers section. That was it. To me, that remains the key component of the ETM campaign, despite being so easily overlooked. The essence of ETM is identifying the root of what’s wrong, promoting the proper Jewish values and ideas, and uniting an “army of normal people” to stand behind them. This group cuts straight through the demographic lines, stereotypes, labels, and other over-hyped forms of classification. The only “type” of person who is capable of signing the covenant is a Jew who has thought through what he believes, proudly stands behind it, and feels a passion for being part of something great.
The publicity for ETM was simple. I plastered the Yeshiva University campus with fliers on which were printed ENDTHEMADNESS.ORG in large block letters, and nothing more. I figured a few people would be curious enough to check it out, and some of them would be excited enough to send annoying emails to everyone they know. I was right, and people started signing up almost immediately.
We started getting e-mails. We got supportive e-mails. We got wacky e-mails. We got stupid questions. The flame had been lit, the message was starting to spread, and I didn’t have the slightest idea what I had gotten myself into.
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{ 24 comments… read them below or add one }
At non frum and non jewish weddings they say “do you love this person for richer for poorer sickness in health…”
At Orthodox fres-oramas they mumble a contract that stipulates 1000 polish zlotas for a divorce in exchange for a gaurantee of virginity.
weddings aren’t the solution, they are the problem
Someone made fun of the very serious Syrian Jewish takana that says they will accept no converts for marriage–hell–at least the Syrians are open about it! The frummies on Ave. J and assorted other black hatters of certain clicks do the same exact thing. Again – - at least the Syrians are open about it!
/not a convert
//would like to convert a 55 Chevy to a hotrod
To the first commenter, I personally think that you may be part right, a serious update of the way ketubas, or the way that people get married may be needed. They can keep the original traditions and make the wedding a more loving event.
I have no idea if there even is a problem, if you take the frum community as a whole they are usually late to catch onto things, I mean look how long it for them to realize the potential of the internet, the goodness of sushi and to warm up to the idea of kiruv.
So to they have taken an extra 20 years to realize that women can work, go to college and get jobs as well. Even when I was a kid, it was as common for a frum women to have a career or go to college, now its almost everywhere. The “problem” and I put it in quotes- because who says its such a problem that people are 30 and single. Its a cycle, you dont think there were single 30 year olds 25 years ago. shit my dad got married at 40 and he’s a frummy.
Just because folks start dating when they are 18 and date for 10 years doesn’t mean they should have started when they were 18. I just think the shidduch crisis is overrated- think about all crisis- it sells books, newspapers and people feel that there is something wrong with them which in turn gives the psychotherapists some dough- they advertise on the shidduch article page in the Jewish Press. Singles weekends are a ripoff and the avg UWS apartment is 3000 bucks a month- everyone wins on the shidduch crisis.
The crisis is not that people are single— the crisis is that “getting a good shiduch” is the reason many people “act” frum. Instead of lectures about “the silent tragedy” how about uplifting, inspirational talks that bring people closer to G-d instead of closer to shadchanim.
Last night a shadchan told me that wearing a hat on shabbos would “help me get a shidduch.” This is the sort of nonsense that is the true crisis, not the fact that I’m 25 and single.
I think the author made some good points, but the part about how at his sister graduation the seating was separate- was ridiculous.
Most of the older singles are not products of the separate seating arrangements- they are products of a Modern Orthodox upbringing that put work and schooling first.
Also most of those people in separate seating places WANT there to be separate seating- its not some revolt against society- you send your kids to Bais Yaakov for that reason.
David: You are absolutely right, though it comes to bite you in the ass, and why the hell would someone want to marry someone who isn’t right for them. Being miserable is a whole lot worse then having a seemingly good shidduch.
I always said that the problem isnt finding a shidduch but rather its finding a “good” shidduch. These days everyone has issues. Whether its with health, wealth, family, religious views ect. No one is perfect. Not that there ever was a time that pple were perfect, but this day and age everyone has some sort of problem and pple dont want to deal with it. Here are some reasons why a person might push away a shidduch:
1) If a person is a BT or went off one time in their life, pple are more scepticle and wont go into a shidduch right away with out looking deaper into it.
2) If a person was once sick, many pple would stay away because they are afraid of what might happen in the future with them or their children.
3) If someone comes from a divorced/broken home, a person might not want such a shidduch because they are afraid the he/she will be like the parents.
4) Pple dont want to deal with money issues.
5) Many pple dont like to marry outside of their chassidus or similar groups or backrounds. Someone asked me to find her son a shidduch this passed summer so I did, she was everything they were looking for and the same went for the girl, but the mother said no because she wanted her son to have a mitzva tance and the girls side didnt. THAT was the reason they said no!!!
There are a million excuses for pushing away a shidduch and most are for stupid reasons. I mean it is their perogative but they shouldnt complain that they are still single at 30 because their choices at that age wont be any better, if not worse.
I think its BS that a single person shouldnt read shidduchim, what kind of crap is that?!?! I am single and try reading shidduchim ALL the time. And pple actually listen to my suggestions. I’ve never actaully done a shidduch (I’ve just started) but pple did go out and give it a try. I was usually on target with personality and what each was looking for but they wernt attracted to eachother, and that isnt in mine or anyone elses hands.
I also feel that it is the parents who make it hard for their children. They are the ones who push away shidduchim for them because it doesnt meet their high standards. Everyone thinks they are chashuva yidden and their child is perfect and needs perfection!!
I completely agree with ETM!! I just went on a rant with my co worker on how rediculous society is! They tell the girls and boys to stay away from eachother and how bad it is to interact and then we are thrown into shidduchim and its terrible if we are not married at 18-19 years old with 1 and a half children! If a girl/boy is separated from boys/girls all their lives, how do you expect them to have a normal marriage/relationship with eachother and be able to understand one another??
They tell us girls to be tznius and try not to attract attention to ourselves but when we become “kallah maidels” we should dress extra nice and presentable for the world to see us so we can get a good shidduch.
And last but not least, they tell us how bad and horrible sex is and how its the most aweful thing and we should stay away from any thoughts we ever have on the subject, but when we get engaged and are “taught” by our chosson/kallah teachers on how beautiful it is and you shouldnt feel embarrassed or ashamed ect ect.-how can a person keep sane??
I beleive society made its own crises and keeps on making it worse. Eveyone complains on how bad the situation is but doesnt do a darn thing to fix it and to look deaper into the “problem”! Instead they make chumras making sure girls dont wave their hands in the air to attract attention to themselves!!
Dude I love your comment and thank you, I am in much agreement- especially the rant about separating the sexes until its time to make babies.
I agree that the problem is the strict separation until marriage. A sensible middle ground needs to be found.
David, I agree with your comment wholeheartedly, and Hesh, with comment number one.
But I have to say, ETM TICKS ME OFF!!!! ARGH!!! Sorry but I think that nowdays people aren’t honest enough with themselves about how much they are able to control their thoughts and actions, in theory its one thing and in practice it ends up being QUITE another. Yes, tons of problems exist in the shidduh world, but there is a movement to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Like getting pre-nups to avoid agunah situations instead of bashing in the heads of men who refuse to give their wives gets with a baseball bat or two, like the halacha requires. We’ve gotten so caught up in secular society that we forget what we were going for in the first place.
I had a whole long debate with my friend’s mom (who also happens to be a shadchan, btw) the other day, about ETM and c0-ed events. Frankly I’ve spent enough time in these mixed environments to know that the theory behind the glory and practicality and FOCUS of it all goes out the window the second guys and girls are given the go-ahead to mix freely. Guys start thinking (and often behaving) like animals, while girls start putting on all of this disgusting display behavior. All of this is instinct multiplied by a thousand due to secular cultural influences that have infiltrated frum society. You know how it goes, behavior is normal until it’s taken to the extreme, at which point it becomes psychosis.
There HAS to be a better solution.
(Incidentally I just wrote a whole post about the singles crisis although I think I was tired and forgot about my point somewhere along the line.)
I think you are all missing one of the fundamental differences between where the actual shidduch crisis is taking place and what you guys are talking about. Almost all of the comments keep noting that the separation of sexes from early ages leads to the shidduch crisis.
My question to you is this: if this were so, why is this so called shidduch crisis mainly found in the Modern Orthodox and moderately yeshiva communities- in which the separation of the sexes is not the main focal pint of children’s education and programs.
Please go to Lakewood, Monsey, Williamsburg, KJ, BP etc…. and show me this shidduch crisis you are talking about… it simply does not exist.
The shidduch crisis that everyone is making such a fuss about is located in more modern communities like Baltimore, the Upper West Side, North Jersey and Queens- which are known as being more modern communities where kids are more likely to go to Modern schools that do not place such importance on the separation of the sexes.
Take a look at the “frum” BY type schools- I am not talking about Baltimore- I talking about real hardcore BY- these girls ARE getting married at young ages still.
Though I think that just because people are waiting till later ages to marry doesn’t mean there is a crisis- it means that frum Jews have no idea how to deal with change.
Hey Hesh I was wondering where all the commenter’s went- good job in bringing them back full force.
I wanted to know what the hell is up with singles events that are single sex? Can someone explain that to me.
The very existence of a crises is the crises itself
You, know, there are tribes in Papua New Guinea and the Pacific Islands in which men and women live in separate villages. Perhaps we could try that.
Yes, but then we lose the gripping power we have over them. They could also pull an Animal Farm stunt against us and overthrow those who rule over them from a distance.
Firstly, I completely disagree with channi, I dont know if the “crisis” is everywhere but it certainly is in the more yeshivish communities as well such as NY, Lakewood, Monsey ect. Maybe there are a lot more marriages in the more “frummer” circles but there are just as many singles out there that come from such families. You should talk to a couple of shaddchanim in such areas and they will show you their lists of THOUSANDS of pple who need shidduchim. It does exist channi, open your eyes!
And just a side point to your theory of thinking that the complete separation of the sexes is the reason for more marriages-if you talk to pple and get around with your ears wide open you will see how many divorced and twisted marriages there are out there even in the major FRUM communities such as BP and Williamsburg. These days pple do as they please whether moral or not and you shouldnt let their livush fool you. I know quite a number of stories where a chassidish couple from so and so cheated on eachother and so on! The separation might help, but to a certain degree. And society went way passed that degree, we see that it doesnt help much anymore.
Funky:
I agree that men are animals and have a really hard time controlling themselves. (I have heard it more then once from members of the male species themselves lol!) But in order to make the world go round, men and woman have to live together. And all society is trying to do is separate us, then they complain about a shidduch crisis! They made their own crisis and its just going to keep on biting them in the tuches if they dont start getting a clue about the true nature of human kind.
Now I am not saying they should put us all in a night club and make us dance till out pants come down but but they should definitely stop trying to separate us so much and focus on putting us together in a kosher and non harmful way!
we just had a seminary options evening the other night in school and they had a speaker talk about the benefits of going to israel and everything and surprisingly she reassured us that contrary to popular belief not going wont harm your shidduch prospects but apparently everything else does! The second i graduate its gonna be all about whos getting married im so freaked out!
flatbush gal -
I am TERRIFIED of graduating too. Its all going to be about the race to the alter the red-hot second we’re handed our diplomas!
Jeez College will be the best years of your life as long as you go away to a school far away from home- so you can actually know what freedom is.
If you live within 150 miles of home you will never taste true freedom. Oh and get a car- the ultimate American freedom is taking to the road with your buddies.
The crises is even worse for those of us trying to get married a second time. Come to think of it, a bigger crises then the Shidduch Crises is the Divorce Crises. But that is TOTAL TABOO in the picture perfect Black Hat Yeshivah world.
yeah well im not sure Brooklyn c. is even 1 mile from home so there goes that
av-my best friends parents got divorced and now theyre both remarried it seemed to go pretty smoothly for them tho from ur comments im not sure if u would find them ‘black hat’ even tho their hats may be black
From what I see from my friends, the shidduch crisis is not about the separation but about the insane expectation and constant bitching.
Guys, you’re ugly, fat, bald, etc. and you’ll only get worse with age. Don’t complain about a girl being 5lb overweight when you’re 50lb overweight. I agree that if a girl is a foot taller than you or weighs 50lb more than you, you got a point, other wise, suck it up or you’re gonna be single until you’re 35 or 40.
Girls, Johnny Depp is taken and he’s not gonna marry you, get over it.
If your parents are getting in your way, go to college, get a job and tell them to f off, it’s your life, not theirs.
correction Johnny Depp is taken but not, i repeat not married, so yea there’s still hope.
It ever occur to anyone that people bitch and moan so much bec they actually are quite comfortable with their life and have no desire to put another persons needs ahead of their own? so then the style kippah or skirt lengths come in to play as an excuse, which face it i dont think most people honestly care that much about.
And don’t forget about the whole fun of going out with different people every week/month. Once you’re married, that fun is gone so why get married.
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